Apparently you can't do polls on here.... but

Do any of you think that Jesus actually existed? What do category do you fall into?

A. Believed he existed, claims are false

B. Believed he existed, claims are exaggerated

C. Don't believe he existed

D. Believe he existed, claims are true (sorry had to leave the idiot category open)

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"You make an appeal to authority premised on centuries of vested interest (majority of Biblical scholars) over and above an empirical study of the evidence."
I do no such thing. You're the one who dismissed the majority opinion (i.e. the TF is partially genuine) as "special pleading by Christian apologists". That's garbage: plenty of non-Christian historians hold that conclusion.
So don't give me crap about making an appeal to authority: you're the one who dismissed them out of hand as "Christian apologists" without basis. I'm merely pointing out that that is wrong.

"You are wrong about the conclusions of Origen. He only references "the Brother of James" passages and the rest of the chapter, concluding Antiquities. He characterizes the content in ways that do not comport with the remainder of the text that have survived to our time, as I will explain in my comment on this evidence."
I'll wait for your next post then.
Have any of you seen the movie the Man who came from Earth? Interesting movie for taking place in one cabin with no special effects. Also an interesting scenario on the origins of Christ and his connection with Buddha. A scenario of total fantasy, but a good watch I thought. I am certain it comes off as anti christian dogma to Christians, but I think the idea was only meant to be a mental exercise. Being written by a former Star Trek writer, it's no surprise to see these cultural tenants turned upside down to review.
I'm not suggesting the movie's concepts are plausible at all, it's just a novel bit of entertainment I would recommend.

It's basically about a man who brings all his closest friends to a cabin to tell them he has been alive for 14,000 years. These people all happen to be college professors and scientists, as the main character is as well. The whole movie is basically a semi skeptical inquiry by his friends to determine if he is lying or not, and how a life for 14k years could effect a person.
There probably was a man named Jesus that started a religio-political movement in first century Palestine. In fact, one of his apostles was called the zeolot which leads me to believe that he was part of that group as well. The stories about his miracles are largely stolen from the Hebrew scriptures, and I would suspect that the others are simply made up or stolen from pagan sources. The story of a dying and rising god is a well known pagan myth (e.g. Osiris), and I think that it was merely taken from the mystery religions of the Roman Empire and applied to Jesus over time. So I guess I fall in the "B" category.
This would be called a Euhemerist or Evemerist position, The events and activity of this region are quite well documented for the time, but there is a dearth of textual evidence for your founder of a religio-political movement you mention. I have started to critique the "scrappy" evidences on the previous page.
Interesting.... I learned some new words today. thanks!
I believe, as if belief has any credibility, that jeebus lived, but was the Houdini of his day, a showman. Like now, there was a living to be made as a religious warbler. Also, no education, no knowlege of anything and cultural superstition made a fertile ground for what has become the single biggest con of all time.
Yes, but Arrian states up front that he prefers a source who was contemporary to Alexander, Ptolemy (the "Anabasis", now lost). What author references any source that was actually contemporary to or within a few years of the alleged Jesus?
Many of the early church apologists reference works that were well known to the wealthy and well-educated, especially Tertullian. Christian historians often portray the earliest believers as slaves and among the lowest classes, but the literature poses a profound contradiction.

BTW, the first 3 Popes are not mentioned by any of the earliest patristic apologists. It is not until Irenaeus, many decades after their alleged See in Rome, are they mentioned, in 170 CE at the earliest.
(C) I do not believe Jesus Christ ever existed as an actual person, combined with (E) don't think it matters anyway since all religion is false.
B: I believe there may have been a man named Jesus or it may have been many people all merged in to one character. But I think that any acts of healing were mostly likely a result of him being a well educated man and that when recorded they were greatly exaggerated, as for most of the other events in the bible I find then rather hard to believe.
There is no real historical proof that Jesus ever existed .. The dead sea scrolls, which are first and second century documents which are consistent with "old testament" myths, which don't include Jesus .. The orthodox Jews have a story of a young rabbi, who they believe was a profit, who lived during this period and may have been the person the "Jesus Myths" evolved from.. However, their young rabbi lived, married, and died as a mortal man .. His mother conceived him as the result of a adulteress relationship ,was married to a carpenter. That's where the similarity ends .. the "resurrection" of the zombie god is not part of the story. That's strictly christian mythlogy . My question is, why is a non-religious person like yourself, asking this question? You must know, by now, that all religions are just different shades of "Bullshit" created by the wild imagination of idle men. So my category is : E. Christian mythlogy is unimportant and not relevant to any critical thought.




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