Is Atheism a chiefly liberal or conservative philosophy?

I know this may seem like a bit of an odd question but I’ve been wondering about it for the past few days and for some reason I can’t escape the feeling that it (atheism) would be a rather ‘conservative’ point of view (that is, at least in title), and yet I’m constantly being called a liberal because of my social and political leanings. I'm just wondering what your views are on this.


PS: I’ll be gone for a few days but I will catch up with this thread when I return.

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Via, not because. I reject the idea that just making a profit necessarily entails exploitation of the people who don't make profit.
I'd read some Marx if I were you.
Typical. I've read plenty of Marx. And he does not make a case well. There is no metaphysical class struggle. It's in your heads. Classes and groups don't have rights. And from each according to their ability to those according to their need is sad and weak and completely ignores, as you do, the initial violation of an individual's rights. Statism must use juvenile bullying techniques to get done what people who vote for it wish. There is no peace or reason in that. Just bullying and wishful thinking. As if calling a plan 'social security' will give people social security.
I think he makes some points very well indeed. Just not the ones you are focusing on. There is no metaphysical class struggle? Well I agree, its not metaphysical. You don't think there is any such thing as a power struggle between groups or "classes" of people? What else are we arguing about then?

“I reject the concept of the rich exploiting the poor simply via profit motive. If a company or any group or any individual violates another's individual rights, it should be dealt with by law.”


I take it that blood diamonds aren’t a product of simple profit motives? I mean let us all remember that approximately two-thirds of the world’s diamonds do come from Africa. And yes, they are illegal but it seems that the laws aren’t exactly curbing the flow of them all that much. The same linear analysis could also apply for the illegal narcotics trade too.


Besides poverty is a multifaceted issue to begin with. David Shipler wrote a book on The Working Poor, where he sketches our many of the reasons why poverty exists.

A run-down apartment can exacerbate a child’s asthma, which leads to a call for an ambulance, which generates a medical bill that cannot be paid, which ruins a credit record, which hikes the interest rate on an auto loan, which forces the purchase of an unreliable used car, which jeopardizes a mother’s punctuality at work, which limits her promotions and earning capacity, which confines her to poor housing” (The Working Poor; Invisible in America, 2004).


Now take that excerpt from the book and look for instance at companies that offer “payday loans”. Sure, perhaps you and I wouldn’t need to take advantage of a service like this but when your poor and life is a desperate struggle a service like this could easily be considered a godsend. And sure, you might say that the family doesn’t need to live in a run-down apartment but it’s not easy making a living or providing even a modicum of shelter and security if you live in a box. And you can’t say that the guy offering the loan isn’t exactly preying on the poor, after all why are these places only found in the poorer neighborhoods?


I think Michael that you’re taking a very isolationist view on the whole issue; wealthy people do exploit the poor in countless ways. Ways which helps support the current lifestyle we all have come to enjoy here in the US. And believe me; it’s even worse still in other countries.


I lived for a few years in Australia where there aren’t laws governing monopolies, where services like internet, water, electricity and telephones are hideously overpriced in many areas even if you live a mere few km outside of a major metropolitan area. Where rent for even the cheapest of apartments are averaging $300 a week. And in many cases these companies flagrantly admit they have a monopoly and they’re thankful they don’t live in “the states” (which, by the way, they feel is a backward country).


Sure, maybe making a profit doesn’t necessarily entail the exploitation of people, but it certainly doesn’t hurt.


I mean let’s face it; your rejection of a concept doesn’t make it so. Enough people on here seem to disagree with you but since you also clearly seem to come from opulence I wouldn’t expect you to step away from your lofty surroundings and actually learn the truth, because like knowledge, ignorance can also be a form of power.

All I get from your comment is that because life is hard and conditions may be rough, it is the rich people's fault. There is no essential aspect of capitalism that entails exploitation. People are exploited sometimes, but not because of people being able to keep the product of their work and invest and spend where they like. You claim that hardship is proof of the negative aspects of capitalism, when there is no capitalism. No one is free to make economic choices on their own. The government is everywhere. We live under a socialist government that decides where much of our money goes. And you think the answer is more government. Ever since this government started, people have seen a problem, throw more government at it and then decry capitalists and producers for its lack of success.
That's bullshit, park. If I make a widget and you decide to give me whatever for it, that is trade, even steven. Unfair trade, which would necessitate deception or force, is exploitation. What you do with your money, after the government forcefully takes a bunch of it, and what job you agree to or can get are completely up to you.
But thats what companies are suppose to do if they jobs overseas so much then why don't they just leave the U.S.No offense your not making very much sense here.
What part of your paragraph do you think I missed?
I understand the reason alot of people dislike the government because neither side has addressed the real problem plauing most people is the jobless rate allthough it has gotten alittle bit better.Also has anybody thought about climate change and how we are not doing enough to address this issue i mean look at the series of intense tornadoes the weatheris intensifying just like most scientists predicted.
Ya im just saying the politicians are not doing enough. I know they can not make jobs just poof out of thin air ,but they never stand up to the people who own them.I mean Obamas success hasn't been the economy even though he has had success, it is just dissapointing,but I would think it is climate change because we are using more coal more oil more dirty substances into our atmosphere.If we don't do something soon heat could get traped in the atmosphere and kill our crops.I'm just saying when everyones starving i'm going to be living in my basement with a shit load of canned food!lol
Atheism doesn't demand that one be of any particular type of political stripe. Most atheists are tho of a leftist variety. I am quite a libertarian atheist myself and so while I support and value all sorts of rights also supported by typical lefties, I find that nanny statist liberals indulge in beliefes that government can and will solve all manner of problems quite similar to magical thinking that theists reserve for a deity.

My difference w typical leftists is that they seem to prefer government control over a free market. A free market is simply a means by which people can decide on whatever agreed upon price that involved parties decide upon for voluntarily exchanging in goods and services. Government, on t other hand, is force. Just as it is wrong for any individual to force another to do something against their will, it is also wrong for a god or a government. And if one wants something to get done then one ought to either do it themselves or get others to do it voluntarily, rather than relying on government or god to get it done.

Again, I see it as magical thinking similar to that demonstrated by theists. Tho I find this to be a minority position among atheists.




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