Is it nature that creates?
Well, Nature is a part of existence is it not? This brings me to answer this question with the following question for you Poll Arthor:
Giving Existence itself is the Sum total of all that exists definition:
n.1. The fact or state of existing; being.2. The fact or state of continued being; life: our brief existence on Earth.
3.a. All that exists: The sum of all existence.b. A thing that exists; an entity.
This to which includes every force to cause, process, function, person, place, thing, or according to the question you purposed, Nature itself.. So here are my questions Future 2:
Q1: What is God without Existence?
Q2: If Existence is god, then what of existence is not when Existence is defined as all that exists?
Q3: If Existence is not GOD, Then what of existence is when Existence is defined as all that exists?
And lastly, and the more telling question to which answers your own:
Can you Poll Arthor, explain to me Causality, why we are here, how we got here, where we came from, life, consciousness, nature, states, forms, complexity, essence of being, reality, or existence itself without existence?
So if you want to complain about others not directly answering your question(s), I dare say I am interested in seeing you answer mine. Hence the question isn't who, but rather what..
Poll Arthor's arguments are really bad.
One idea I like is that mathematics really exists in some sense. We are part of a very complicated mathematical system that became conscious.
The book Our Mathematical Universe by the cosmologist Max Tegmark explains this idea further.
This topic seems to be theist bait ;)
Anything that talks of the possibility of atheists coming to believe is theist bait. Earlier a theist showed up in a discussion about what it would take to convince you that God exists
> This topic seems to be theist bait ;)
True Luara, but I do think it's a great question. And maybe you've pointed out a value in stopping 0.0000000001% short of a claim of absolute certainty. It’s fascinating just why it’s true, as you point out, that our deist brethren can’t seem to resist trying to crack that minute possibility some of us leave open, even despite the fact that they’d have a much better chance buying lottery tickets. Of course we don’t need to prove what’s his name doesn’t exist any more than we need to prove the non-existence of Santa, the tooth fairy or the easter bunny. But why are they so afraid of us that they’re compelled to jump in at even the remotest possibility of converting us? I don’t think it’s because most of their religions push them to proselytize. I think it’s personal. Just a hunch, but it seems to me they think (oftentimes at least) that converting one of us would strengthen their own faith. (Making their own faith all the more idiotic and pathetic, needless to say.)
Yep, and it's why I won't get an honest response from them either.
it seems to me they think (oftentimes at least) that converting one of us would strengthen their own faith.
Yes, and the "virus" was successful in cultural evolution because it induces proselytizing behavior ...
This thread is of such a venerable length that I cannot be certain of not having replied previously. To me as a noncognitivist the question itself makes no sense at all. Charles Bradlaugh put the noncognitivist position quite clearly way back in 1864:
The Atheist does not say "There is no God," but he says: "I know not what you mean by God; I am without idea of God; the word 'God' is to me a sound conveying no clear or distinct affirmation. I do not deny God, because I cannot deny that of which I have no conception, and the conception of which by its affirmer, is so imperfect that he is unable to define it to me."
I am 100% sure. Take all the religions of mankind, and all the gods created in them. The universe does not work in a way described by any. There is no reason to believe it ever did, and no reason to believe that we have one true god unaccounted. Gods are an obvious creation of imagination, including the one we would imagine might exist.
Well put Rich.
Hi Cory.....Isn't it a bummer when you find out what you thought was true about your ancestors is actually a Myth.....I have recently been introduced to archeological findings that could not verify that many of my ancestors never existed....I had already dismissed the propaganda of God and all his miracles, but I still believed in many of the prophets and now fid out that they were a myth too...It sucks
Are you referring to the work of Israeli archaeologist Israel Finkelstein? Though I have to add that most archaeologists working in the Levant share his views on the The Bible's general lack of historicity. Lewis Black does an interesting bit on the Christian misuse of "his people's" book. He is very vocal about his ancestor's propensity to "bullshit" & "make shit up".
Of course making up colourful stories about one's ancestors & their relationships with a host of imaginary friends is a universal human pursuit.