Not sure where else to put this, so...


Since I tend to have knee-jerk reactions, I won't post my thoughts about this right now, except to say I'm mad... and disappointed. I think Jon utterly and completely missed the point... in fact, it's almost as if he misses the point intentionally.

But that's just me...


Culture War Update - The Dividening of America - American Atheists ...


(If you can't see it, I don't know how to help you. I don't know how to download video clips from the Daily Show website. If I did, I'd put this on YouTube. If you know, please... tell me...)

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He does misconstrue the point to poke fun at it, but I do agree that Silverman's statement was pretty dickish and isn't going to win atheists any points in terms of PR... Especially since the argument he makes isn't that good either: for most Christians, the WTC cross is a symbol of hope and a reminder that there's hope to be found even in the ashes of a tragedy.

Following that up with "Guess your God didn't care enough to save those people." is acting like a dick.


And to be honest, I'm not even too sure symbolic cases of this kind are worth filing lawsuits for. Surely we have better things to do.

Silverman might have been a little too "on point" for the comfort of your average person.


As far as Jon Stewart, I think he was pandering to his broader audience. I'm pretty sure that most of his audience is not atheist (although, you can hear applause in the studio after he reads Silverman's comment). Of course that's like making a "gay joke" or a "black joke" just because most of your audience is heterosexual and white.


Now that I think of it, that was a pretty mean-spirited jab at us. I wonder if Al Sharpton will ask him to apologize. Yeah, right.

The point of PR and public appearances is precisely to get the average person on your side and sympathetic to your cause (or at least understanding), so I'd say it's clearly a failure on that point.


And I didn't find the jab all that mean-spirited really. Just a little misinformed considering he just reacted to that small quote.

I personally haven no problem with the cross - it was found naturally - it wasn't created. We have bigger issues to worry about.

This has been my point to so many offended Christians lately.  Thank you, I agree completely.

There are so many bigger battles that need fought right now, this cross is not even on the radar as far as I'm concerned.  Therefore, I have no problem with Jon making fun of what is there for him to work with.  


Of course, weeee know that every once in a while, lol, steel crossbeams might represent the shape of ... a ... cross.  It's not rocket-science.  But if people want to believe it is special we can chuckle as much as we please.  I can think of one hundred different lawsuits that could be filed about real issues affecting the church-state relationship, etc.  If you watch the Daily Show regularly, this could actually have been on our "You're Not Helping" segment.  

Hah, that's the comedy of it all right there! Of course it's gonna look like a cross... they're freaking CROSS BEAMS, of course they're gonna look like a cross, you shmucks!

Stewart has no sacred cows he offends everyone eventually – it's comedy. He's done a number on the fundies from time to time . Beside, Silverman has the diplomacy of Attila the Hun – he needed to have the stool kicked out from under him.
A better use of the money would be to offer to pay to commission and erect a sculpture that would reflect the universality of people of all beliefs or no belief that died on 9/11.
This shit is like the xmas wars - pissing against the wind.

I think that was the best suggestion I have heard. Instead of asking the cross to be removed, simply ask to have something of comparable size placed in the display which serves as a symbol for atheists, like the AA atom Stewart was poking fun at. Good point Jim.

"I recall when all the christians were up in arms in the streets over a muslim center being built, and the vicious things said about them"


That doesn't mean we should stoop to their level.

It isn't that what he said was horrible, inaccurate, etc.  It wasn't.  I just think it is a fight that doesn't need to be fought because the damage it does to the perception of atheists outweighs the benefits.  You have to pick your battles and this is one battle I don't think should have been fought.
Yeah I'm going to side with Silverman rather than Stewart on this one. I too am a huge Daily Show fan, I watch it religiously (mah!) and I think JS is great. I think he also has his flaws and I don't agree with him on everything. This was one point I disagreed with him on more than others. Silverman wasn't being a dick, he was being honest. I don't necessarily agree that Silverman is the best PR guy either, and I often find myself thinking that I would have said things very differently. Still, it was kind of a shock to have JS up there not just poking fun at us atheists, but practically insinuating that all atheists are jerks. And how hypocritical of him too, since he is admittedly a "terrible Jew", one who eats pork and cares not a whit for Jewish practices, but is still not an atheist. If you believe something, then I think you should stick to your convictions and actually act on your beliefs, not just hold them but consciously act against them. And, he did seem particularly offended on behalf of Christians, and didn't get that Silverman was making a philosophical point, albeit a somewhat undiplomatic one. It simply wasn't a funny bit, and it did make me somewhat uncomfortable, but I had quickly forgotten it and forgiven it and was in fact just watching The Daily Show as usual when I came across this post, so although it was bothersome to hear even someone I like as much as JS talking badly about atheists (though not nearly as badly as most others do), I let it roll off my back.
I think that is a succinct point Wanderer.  I agree with you there about JS and the daily show and Silverman.  It is water under the bridge.  Nicely put.




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