“In the beginning, nearly 14 billion years ago, all the space and all the matter and all the energy of the known universe was contained in a volume less than one trillionth the size of the period that ends this sentence.”

— Neil deGrasse Tyson in Astrophysics for People in a Hurry, opening p‘graph

Unsure? Test Tyson’s tale.

Try crushing a rock in one hand until it’s smaller than it is.

It should be easy; 99.99% of the rock is empty of matter.

Why doesn’t it crush?

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Actually i would imagine virgin birthers are hardcore fundamentalists and if they have even a dim bulb will realize it is not the account in genesis. So i don't think a majority will...

Cosmology is the creation of scientific mythology....overstated probably...but alice in wonderland here they come..

Big bang is headed for the trash heap of bad scientific notions. 

Frankie, I read several people who say  what you say, "Big bang headed for the trash heap of bad scientific notions." Can you give me a rationale for why you say that? 

I can believe the notion that something can come from nothing, as the Big Bang implies. I can imagine ways there can be no universe one second, and there can be one in an instant. Take, for example, the notion of branes*, of parallel universes, or of an explosion that produces some form of energy that can, over time, through magnetism or whatever, result in the stuff of making stars. Every time I see a video of an atomic bomb detonated, a tremendous cloud of energy results. Could that not be the same kind of action that would be an explosion that resulted in a matter with the potential of forming clouds, and stars, and planets, and moons? 

*In string theory and related theories such as supergravity theories, a brane is a physical object that generalizes the notion of a point particle to higher dimensions. Branes are dynamical objects which can propagate through spacetime according to the rules of quantum mechanics. They have mass and can have other attributes such as charge."

The Lobster Nebula, "The surrounding nebula, featured here, holds a complex tapestry of gas, dark dust, stars still forming, and newly born stars. The intricate patterns are caused by complex interactions between interstellar winds, radiation pressures, magnetic fields, and gravity."

I am not an astronomer, nor an electrical engineer, nor a physicist, nor an astrophysicist. I have my degrees in behavioral science which do not prepare me for debates on whether the Big Bang is ready for the dustbin. Furthermore, I do not think it is necessary for me to understand how the universe came into being. What does interest me is how I treat others and what I expect from others. I think regarding the philosophy of the bee: it goes from flower to flower to gather nourishment and in the process pollinates flora of all kinds that sexually reproduce. The bee does not wake up in the morning, rub his front arms together, and say, "I wonder why I have to collect pollen today." The bee does what a bee does, and in the process, we have blossoms of trees, fruits, vegetables, and grass made fertile. 

Joan i can't be particularly cogent on this topic. When I first heard the theory I thought it highly probable it would be discredited. The cosmos is so far beyond our Ken that we may never understand it. Perhaps when AI spawns super intelligence it will happen.

The big bang theory requires assumptions and that makes me dubious. If we are going to posit knowledge of ultimate causation we ought not have to create fiction to make it plausible. And while I like your analogy to the bomb ya have to concede that the universe has rather a barrel ass and is rotund in the extreme. Thus the small to big through physics stretches credulity.

Here's a tender tune dedicated to Tom.

(We who are about to drink salute you.)

Bert, I miss many words of pop songs and on 1/11 will be tested for a hearing aid.

I will ask the Internet for the text of zappa’s song. If I get it I will know what he’s saying and know whether to thank you or say s’thing else. (grin)

@Tom - I totally suck at getting song lyrics too.

Frank Zappa – Cosmik Debris Lyrics

The Mystery Man came over
An' he said: "I'm outa-site!"
He said, for a nominal service charge,
I could reach nervanna t'nite
If I was ready, willing 'n able
To pay him his regular fee
He would drop all the rest of his pressing affairs
And devote His Attention to me
But I said. ..
Look here brother,
Who you jivin' with that Cosmik Debris?
(Now who you jivin' with that Cosmik Debris?)
Look here brother,
Don't you waste your time on me

The Mystery Man got nervous
An' he fidget around a bit
He reached in the pocket of his Mystery Robe
An' he whipped out a shaving kit
Now, I thought it was a razor
An' a can of foamin' goo
But he told me right then when the top popped open
There was nothin' his box won't do
With the oil of Afro-dytee
An' the dust of the Grand Wazoo
He said:
"You might not believe this, little fella, but it'll cure your Asthma too!"
An' I said. ..
Look here brother,
Who you jivin' with that Cosmik Debris?
(Now what kind of a gu-roo are you anyway?)
Look here brother,
Don't you waste your time on me
Don't waste yer time. ..

I've got troubles of my own, I said
An' you can't help me out
So take your meditations an' your preparations
An' ram 'em up yer snout
An' held it to the light
So I snatched it
All away from him
An' I showed him how to do it right
I wrapped a newspaper 'round my head
So I'd look like I was Deep
I said some Mumbo Jumbos then
An' told him he was goin' to sleep
I robbed his rings
An' pocket watch
An' everything else I found
I had that sucker hypnotized
He couldn't even make a sound
I proceeded to tell him his future then
As long as he was hanging around,
I said
"The price of meat has just gone up
An' yer ol' lady has just gone down. .. "
Look here brother,
Who you jivin' with that Cosmik Debris?
(Now is that a real poncho or is that a Sears poncho?)
Don't you know,
You could make more money as a butcher,
So don't you waste your time on me
(Don't waste it, don't waste your time on me. ..)
Ohm shonty, ohm shonty, ohm shonty-ohm
- - - - -

You're welcome.

Bert, my lyrics. All it needs is music and two front teeth.

“His dad was a big city butcheri,

A Mom, Pop, and Kids place it was.

But the kid says he’ll keep on shovin’ 

More of that old Cosmic Debris

Way up those Bangers’ snouts.”

Outstanding lyrics, Tom. 

I need a little translation, are you willing and able to help me out? What does the line,

"An' yer ol' lady has just gone down. .. "?

The “An yer ol’ lady....” line is Zappa’s, Joan.

He may see meaning in it.

OK! I thought it might be a jargon word that had a meaning you gentlemen would know. I shall ask Zappa what it means. Thanks. Laura loves your response; I guess I will too if the fine gentleman answers my question. 

I have a letter my great-grandfather wrote to his son and he wrote, "The old lady died last week" meaning my great-grandmother. 

OH! You guys are special, thanks for letting me in on your high jinks! You made my new years evening fun. 


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