Keep in mind that Hitler, Stalin and Pol Pot didn't commit their crimes against humanity by themselves. They had lots and lots of help from lots and lots of people every bit as evil as they were. 

If there is a god he/she/it sucks because he/she/it knowingly created a whole lot of evil people who are simply no damn good. Man knew what to do with undesirable canines... man culled the species.

 

As you may know the worst of humanity in the US live in the red state and more specifically the Bible Belt where hate, immorality, hypocrisy and ignorance abound. My every metric, the Bible belt is the "sin belt". This is true of other red states. 

The treaty of Versailles was a huge mistake. All it did was make the already rabid Germans even worse. Eisenhower and the allies figured this out because at the end of WW-2 Nazis at every level were killed. Today Germany has a strong peacetime economy and will probably never present a threat to mankind. 

The fascist problem in the US in IMO far worse than what the world faced from Germany in the 30's and 40's and the fascists in the US have nothing to bitch about other than their own sloth, gluttony, ignorance and incompetence. The Germans had some justification for being pissed off.

See the source image

There are some naive folks of the liberal persuasion who will spout the hypocritical cliche, "It will make you no different than them". To that I call bullshit. We are different than them. We are better than them. We all know what happens when we ignore bullies... bullies ramp up their bullying. 

This Article Goes In To The Depravity Of Trump Supporters 

 

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Hey Chuck..no argument about Trump or his supporters. I just don't think the analogy to nazi germany is on all fours.. 

First USA is polarized...doubt there are many on the fence..ya hate the guy or you worship him. Nazi Germany on other hand was behind him in a big way.  Now i know Trump has not seized power and Hitler did. But the polarization would be even stronger if he attempted to do so. 

Also as fascism was on the rise we saw even German Americans wildly supportive of Hitler. The German American bund had large gatherings in Madison Square Garden and in California there were large gatherings in support of Hitler. 

Also USA has a longer and more sustained period of democracy than Germany. Democracy is of course antithetical to fascism. As a result our citizenry as a whole is  less susceptible to fascism. Not only does Germany have less experience with democracy but they have far greater history of authoritarianism and anti-semitism. In the revolutions of 1848 Germans dabbled in revolution but were more deferential of authority (royalty) than other Europeans.  

So at the time in Germany the antecedents were in place....and we all know about Versailles and the economy and the pacifism of the French but Germany's peculiar history was critical to its metamorphosis. I don't doubt that there are bible belt areas who would under the right circumstances back Trump were he to attempt a coup. But that is not enough to make it happen....

I knew about the bunds as I knew a Jewish man who retaliated violently against them. They beat the crap out of a lot of American Nazis. There is a lot of autism/Aspergars in the German population still. They are rigid in their thinking and it is not just a stereotype and it is not simply cultural. My brother in law was a chief engineer at United Technologies and the often competed with Seimans for contracts. Seimens lost a lot because they were so inflexible and often their equipment and engineering was not as good as they thought it was. It's arrogance. They still won't admit that their cars today suck. BMW used to mean Bavarian Motor Works now it means Big Money Wasted or Bavarian Murder Weapon. Audis and Mercedes are not much better but I doubt a German CEO would admit that. 

Trump is German. Trump is arrogant, rigid and cold hearted. Nixon surrounded himself with people of German descent. e.g. Haldeman, Erlichmann, Kliendeinst and Zigler. 

Germany was a younger Democracy but I don't thing that fully explains the rise of the Nazis and Hitler. Germany was hurting badly. Conversely the US was in good economic shape after Obama fixed it and even after the banksters wrecked the economy Americans didn't suffer the way the German people did. The German people were in survival mode and Hitler who I believe was apolitical same as Trump, exploited the situation. 

The South suck mostly because of the people who live their. They have low IQ's and and even lower morals. They are not like their industrious Yankee cousins. The plantation owners were the original 1%. The white peasants didn't care that the slave trade was cruel and the white peasants there today don't care that the slave trade was a holocaust but they see it and their dreadful treasonous flag as a symbol of heritage. I see it as a symbol of treason and had I been the 16th president, I would have ordered the execution of the Southern aristocracy and confederate military officers that would have made Nuremberg look like a pillow fight.

Hitler's Germans were poorly informed whereas Trump disciples knew exactly what he was but they didn't care. When Trump said he could shoot somebody and still not lose voters he was right. Had Hitler said that, he probably would have lost some support. Had Hitler bragged about grabbing women by the pussy, he probably would have lost support. Had Hitler swindled people, he probably would have lost support. 

America is under a mild form of fascism. In theory America is a democratic republic governed by the consent of the people but in reality our federal government which is supposed to be the watchdog of the people's and civil rights is in reality the lap dog of the corporations. Corporatism is fascism. The millionaire class needs to give up its obscene wealth or be marched to the guillotine. Greed is not good.

I don't summarily reject religious teachings and I think that the so called deadly sins and heavenly virtues are right. If I were a Christian and were brainwashed enough to ignore all the BS in the BuyBull, I would be a Calvinist. Many people are simply no damn good and an army of shrinks exorcists and theologians can't change them. Narcissists and sociopaths are born that way and Southern Christianity makes them worse. They role around on the floor in some church, babble and foam at the mouth and after that they think they are saved. At least the Catholics confess their sins and the Jews make atonement. Buddhists are taught to be humble as are Catholics. 

A violent coup could never succeed but I would like to see them try. It would give the military an excuse to root out racists, traitors and crooks. Florida could use a few years of martial law while we round up the medical criminals and the other drug dealers. 

It is my firm belief that the Trump supporter is far more depraved and dangerous than the Hitler support of 1933. They've proven it.

What say you Chuck?

Lots to chew on there Chuck.

Much of what you have written is fine by me.

My strongest disagreements are with following notions: 1 Hitler's Germans were poorly informed whereas Trump disciples knew exactly what he was but they didn't care. 2. It is my firm belief that the Trump supporter is far more depraved and dangerous than the Hitler support of 1933.

There is little doubt that supporters of Trump knew what he was and what he is. If they did not know during the election they know now...although one can argue they are as blind as a fundamentalist and accept the right's spin hook line and sinker. But for the sake of testing your idea i will impute knowledge.

The exact same knowledge was firmly within the grasp of the rank and file of German supporters of Hitler. (Unlike Trump's supporters who are in minority Hitler's support was overwhelming) Hitler's seizure of power with its authoritarianism, racism and vicious aggression were understood in 1933 and in the subsequent years. The Germans knew about the Spanish Civil war, knew about the holocaust, knew about the atrocities and their support never wavered until perhaps the point at which defeat was inevitable. And this support in spite of tremendous losses of German citizens and full knowledge of the holocaust. It is also instructive to consider how eagerly Hitler Youth volunteered in overwhelming numbers. (Joining was later compulsory but at first was voluntary.)

If the Germans had won no doubt the world's Jews would be gone and other undesirables would have followed. As low as Trump supporters are I don't think the majority would be in favor of a genocide against Mexicans, Blacks or Jews. I don't know how it is possible to be much more depraved than Germans were. 

I'm against Fascism too, but don't consider those who get caught up in such movements "evil people". I have no need to put them down as human beings in order to elevate my own worth in my eyes. Let's separate our judgment of actions and political movements from judgments of others as lesser beings. As a Caucasian US citizen I bear plenty of collective guilt for the actions of my nation and forbearers. We all need to reinvent ourselves better.

The Total Depravity Of Trump Supporters. Posted by Chuck Roast on December 13, 2018 at 4:19pm in Politics 

My response Part 1. Those who lived at the time of and under the control of Hitler, Stalin and Pol Pot  experienced a life very different from those who lived under Roosevelt, Truman, Eisenhower, Kennedy,  and L. B. Johnson after the Great Depression and WW II. The economy grew, men had paid work that provided a living wage, women, on the most part, stayed at home to raise the children, there was enough money for vacations, higher education with the help of grants and scholarships, families could save for retirement, and the standard of living rose as productivity rose. More and more women entered the paid labor force, and in the 1970’s productivity continued to rise as wages and buying power fell. Nixon took the money off the gold standard and inflation began to rise. Not tied to gold, money could be printed as fast as demand required it. More money in circulation, rising inflation, and stagnant wages resulted in the lowering the standard of living for paid labor. More of the wealth went to the rich as the working class experienced declining living standards. The wealth gap widened and the class differences grew. 

Part 2 

Those who committed crimes against humanity during the time of Hitler, Stalin, and Pol Pot lived under very different conditions. 

German, before Hitler, lived under the burden of the debt owed because of that country’s involvement in WWI. Inflation rose to the point that working people wanted to be paid before lunch and before dinner because their buying power declined with the inflated prices. The German population went to war, creating WWII. ”Hitler’s political principles consisted of ”Capital is always the result of labor, and is dependent upon the same human factors as labor itself. Capital relies upon the freedom and power of the state, but must not be allowed to dominate the state. Though capital is the property of individuals, its use also affects the welfare of the state; it must therefore be directed to promote the national well being. In short, Hitler believes that economic boundaries should coincide with political boundaries; hence he denounces 'the economic bourse (stock exchange) capital controlled by the Jews,' which, he says, is manipulated to work the overthrow of national states.” Thus his grounds for a ”People and Fatherland. What we have to fight for is to ensure existence and increase of our race and our people, the support of our children and the maintenance of the purity of their blood, the freedom and independence of the Fatherland; so that our people may be able to carry out the mission assigned them by the Creator of the universe. Every thought and every idea, every teaching and all learning, must serve this purpose. From this point of view everything is to be tested, and, according to its suitability, either applied or rejected.” 

Under this philosophy, Hitler built the finest highway system in existence even as he engineered the killing of Jews. 

Russia, under Stalin, was an ally during WWII. However the conditions for the people declined even after the defeat of the monarchs. Millions died in famine after the failed experiment of collectivization, its agriculture remained at the same level in 1939 as in 1928 with a 40 million increased population. The nation became a government that enabled people to inform on neighbors who did not submit to the rules of Stalin. Secret police actively encouraged people to inform on family members, neighbors, and work mates. Russia’s most talented people were murdered during the 1930 Purges. Stalin, with growing paranoid behavior, imprisoned or murdered writers and artists with talent who opposed him. Most of the senior officers of the Soviet army were arrested and murdered during the Purges. The vast Soviet army became a body without a brain as most of her senior officers had been arrested and murdered during the Purges.

https://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/modern-world-history-1918-to-...

Cambodia and Viet Name, under Pol Pot was communist known as Khmer Rouge from 1975-1979. An estimated 1.5 to 2 million Cambodians died of starvation, execution, disease, and overwork. The government attempted to socially engineer a classless communist society. They killed intellectuals, ethnic Vietnamese, civil servants, city residents, and religious leaders. Pol Pot and his regime are considered by many as the most barbaric and murderous in recent history. 

https://www.history.com/topics/cold-war/pol-pot

Part 3

There is no god and people were not created good or evil. They simply are born, and with the interplay of nature and nurture, each person becomes whole and healthy or fractured and unhealthy. Those who were born in our southern states grew up with an attitude of entitlement, thinking they have supremacy over those they do not recognize as fully human. Slavery is not because the individual is evil, the culture is based on fractured and unhealthy philosophy. The ”Bible Belt” is the result of fractured and unhealthy philosophy. 

My understanding of the end of WW II was that trials found murderers guilty and executed them. Those not tried became part of society. What did get out of control was Capitalism and its emphasis on profits, not people. We are not better than or worse than anyone, we are different. Some cultures are healthier than others. The society in which we now live is not a healthy society. The power of money, the corporations declared as persons, the wealth that conducts business based on greed, selfishness, disregard for life of all kinds will bring us to an unnecessary death of life as we know it. 

Ruth,  how is it you have understood Chuck's psyche in wanting to elevate himself by putting others down? Maybe i am missing it but i have not come away with that notion. He judges people by their actions. If we are honest i think we will all concede we do the same thing. Lets take a murderer for instance,  do we avoid casting aspersions or thinking ill of that person? If one is part of mass murder like a nazi...should we excuse their actions just because they are caught up in the frenzy of blood, hatred and sense of superiority?  I should not think Chuck feels elevated or superior just because he is not a nazi or a bible belt moron. Talk about a low bar! 

How the heck do you bear responsibility for the actions of your forbears?  That sounds like original sin or blaming the Jews for death of Jesus. It is nuts!

Ruth,  how is it you have understood Chuck's psyche in wanting to elevate himself by putting others down? Maybe i am missing it but i have not come away with that notion. He judges people by their actions. If we are honest i think we will all concede we do the same thing. Lets take a murderer for instance,  do we avoid casting aspersions or thinking ill of that person? If one is part of mass murder like a nazi...should we excuse their actions just because they are caught up in the frenzy of blood, hatred and sense of superiority?  I should not think Chuck feels elevated or superior just because he is not a nazi or a bible belt moron. Talk about a low bar! 

How the heck do you bear responsibility for the actions of your forbears?  That sounds like original sin or blaming the Jews for death of Jesus. It is nuts!

What makes you think Frankie that you know what I think and feel? How Trumpian and dishonest is that?

You got one thing right Frankie. I definitely judge people by their actions. 

Frankie asks, "How the heck do you bear responsibility for the actions of your forbears?" Germany did it for the Jews by returning property to them stolen by the Nazis because they felt a sense of responsibility. It's called morality and the Bible belt full of immoral people. 

Germany even when it was Nazi, was still more moral than the American South. The human trafficking known as American slavery lasted 373 years. After that the Blacks were subjected to the KKK, segregation and the Jim Crow laws. 

There are people who are morally defective. We have names for them such as sociopaths, psychopaths, malignant narcissists, pathological liars but regardless of what label we put on them the fact remains that they are no damn good. The metrics that measure crime, and immorality show exactly what the American South is and was. They prove their hypocrisy, immorality and criminal mind set  when they open their lying bigoted mouths by voting for Republicans.

It took the great loss of life and treasure to free the slaves but had Lincoln thought like me, he would have executed most of the confederate forces from sergeant on up, every slave owner, every confederate politician and every slave owner. 

The filthy liars in the South maintain to this day that the Civil War was about state's rights. They also call it the war of Northern Aggression. Those statements are not only lies, they traitorous. 

Had the Union purged the South of its moral defectives there would not have been Jim Crow laws, segregation,  lynchings, church burnings, etc... 

The depravity on the Bible Belt is less of an indictment of the Bible and more of an indictment of the people who use such a vile book for their morality.

Chuck you misunderstand.

Ruth said she has no need to feel elevated by comparing herself to fascists and the like..

She implied that u were doing that. I on other hand read your piece and that thought never crossed my mind. I made the assumption you did not feel that way. But never made a positive assertion or declaration as to your state of mind. 

And no nothing I said about you or in general is Trump-like. Trump makes positive declarations about people that are tendentious and self serving, ad hominem and infantile.  

 As to the issue of southern whites v. German Nazis I disagree but it is perhaps best to let it rest. But if you are curious and read the history of Germany and pre-Germany you may have your eyes opened. 

There is a fascinating and informative book recommended by a member of AN (forgot title..author named Black I think) indicating that defacto slavery in us a far outlasted emancipation. Major corporations purchased blacks and worked them to death in horrible conditions. Private individuals also purchased blacks. And in general there was terror among free blacks that they too would be victimized. This state of affairs lasted into 20th century. 

I don't think you are right that executing responsible southern whites would have been as influential as you suppose. Lynchings occurred in North as well as south. Kik was everywhere and if memory serves at its height there were around 1 million members of KKK. Thomas J Jefferson who is acclaimed as such a great and enlightened man had many slaves and one anecdote about him stays w me. He received a letter from free black scientist and was gobsmacked how articulate and cogent the scientist was. So even Jefferson was a racist. So a purge was not going to do it although I agree w you that they deserved it. I don't go along w moral relativism as an excuse for the inexcusable...same goes for mob mentality...

Germany before it was Germany was warlike. I know the history of the region.

Southern Whites to a large degree are very different than the stock who came to the Northern colonies and Northern states. Culturally are different as well as genetically. Southerners have lower IQs than Northerners and that goes to genetics.

The lower IQ of the conservative is a scientific certainty. Most of that goes to genes. Genes can account for all sorts of behaviors. 

Jefferson freed his slaves. but he was a scumbag in many ways He owned slaves because he was greedy. He was a pedophile and a cheater. Sally Hemmings was a teen when he began molesting her. 

The Truth About Jefferson

The revolutionary was was in part predicated on greed and taxed. King George was far less a tyrant than Trump and far less a lowlife than the corporate gangsters. 

Slavery was about greed. The Southern aristocracy was the original 1%. Greed is in their DNA. These Machiavellian slime balls probably believed that Africans were full human beings but they started that false narrative to convince the mentally defective that Africans were sub human. That is still going on today and it is disgraceful.

Hillary got it wrong when she said 50% of Trump supporters are deplorable. It's closer to 100%. 

Let's take the birthers. While those bastards are not the sharpest tools in the shed they also knew that even it Obama were born in Kenya it would not not matter because his mother was an American. Only very depraved individuals would spread that lie out of their maniacal and ignorant hatred for people of African descent. That is the Trump supporters.

This whole thing goes to dogs vs their wolf ancestors. You can trust a dog but you can't trust a wolf. Humans culled canines until they produced a useful and safe animal. That has not happened with the human animal yet and if it doesn't happen, the human race will not survive. This is not some academic exercise, this is reality. 

Robespierre had the right idea when it came to the filthy rich aristocracy. The filthy rich then and now know that Jesus never existed but they use the Christian ethics to cow the dimwitted hypocritical peasants who wish to be just like them.

I tend to like the Christian ethic of kindness and charity but the turn the other cheek crap was probably an invention of the Roman empire.

It is really quite simple. Bad people are bad people and there is no reforming them. The world would be better off with out them it it. People who are predisposed to lie, cheat, steal, rape, murder or molest children should be exterminated or put into cages or at least sterilized.  Anything else is a crime against humanity.

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