Zionism at its finest: Jewish Settlers attacking Palestinians and Israel is keeping quiet about it.

Jewish Settlers in the West Bank are still attacking and persecuting Palestinians.

Personally I think Israel should not be supported by the West and be forced to hand the occupied territories back to the Palestinians.
Because a stupid set of fake books and Zionist propagandists conning the British into giving them land is no real solid basis for existence of a territory. 

But Zionism is still gaining strength and Jews are more determined to take over the land they claim their dumb, outdated God / Yahweh, gave to them.  
When factually there never was any actual Israel in the past nor any valid claim for the territory, since Jews were an offshoot of Canaanite Arabs originally.

Jews to Canaanite religion is the same relationship as Mormons to Christianity.
Offshoots created by charlatans.

The Jewish settlers are still trying to steal land from the Palestinians today.
Al Nakba ( the Zionist persecution of Palestinians) lives on. 


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I did not say they are a race. Learn to read with at least a modicum of comprehension. 

I do note however that you do make assertions and affirm Plinius as though Jews are a race in ascribing racial characteristics to Jews. Reminds me of modern Nazis who sometimes deny the holocaust and bemoan the failure of the Nazis to finish the job!

Jews are a distinct ethnic group as much as any people are: genetically similar and culturally similar. The endless straw dogs you have beaten to death do not change facts. Yes, Judaism has religious mythology that has no bearing on reality. Thank you Sherlock. Same can be said for all western religion. 

Said mythology does not have any bearing on Jews as a people any more than other religious mythology has any bearing on other groups as a people. 

Learn to reason with the likes of a baboon!

Frankie Ol' M8!
I have not seen anything from Plinius that could be labelled as racist, or maybe I misses something.
Palestinians are not a race, they are also mixed both in racial heritage and in religion. 
I have friends who are Palestinian Christians.
They fight alongside their Muslim comrades for freedom of Gaza, etc....

So I don't see why you have been calling Plinius "Racist". 

I don't see any racial issues with the conflict between Palestine and Israel, since the Jews were essentially Arabs in their origin. 

I just think it is wrong to base land ownership on religious BS. :p 

Well said, I agree. And certainly, Plinius is not a racist. Even her nationality,  The Netherlands, has a rich history of inclusion of all races. 

Name calling is not an effective nor efficient means to debate issues. It gets in the way of clear thinking. I felt as though Plinius had been attacked from behind. Name callers make it very difficult to stay on topic, always trying to defend oneself instead of defending an idea. So there is disagreement in this line of discussion. That is an honest, fair, and correct situation for us to take on. Name calling defeats good debate, leaving one using weapons of personality-destruction instead of an exploration of ideas. 

I am leaving this string and will no longer invite name -callers into my discussions. 

Plinius is clearly a racist. It is not slander or libel when the speaker is telling the truth. You take that passage to any fair minded judge and the conclusion will always be the same. RACIST!

The Netherlands being inclusive is not relevant. We ought to examine an individual without reference to their ancestry, home, gender etc

The Israelis own the land because they defeated the Arabs. They went to the region because the Germans with help from a lot of nations sought to EXTERMINATE them.

Religious BS is not why they went there or own the land. It is no different with the USA starting a war with Mexico under the banner of manifest destiny...God's chosen.  Nations act in own interest and their pretext for taking land or enslaving (also justified w God BS) is dicta..not actually germane. The crusades are probably as close as u can get to people trying to steal land based on religious BS. But Even there the church is a political institution and they stirred the pot in the interest of adding Jerusalem and killing muslims, in other words Power.

Frankie Ol' M8!  So Wrong.

The Arabs did not own the land, the British and then the U.N. owned the land.
The Israelis cheated on the occupation test set out in the Balfour agreement.
They pretended to have a 30% majority by stealing land from the current residents and pushing them out.
That is what is called Al Nakba. 
The Zionist plot to deprive Arabs of their land, in the name of a stupid set of false books.

You really are not up with reality, are you? 

You cannot win land through conquest if those you are fighting don't have the title to the land.

They did not defeat the owners of the land or the U.N.

They only defeated the current squatters.

The only way Israel could take ownership of Gaza / West Bank is to get the land allotted to them by the U.N. ( current title holders). 
Killing the Arabs won't give them ownership.


It is the Balfour Declaration not agreement as you say.

"The zionist plot to deprive Arabs of their land, in the name of a stupid set of false books"....ha ha ha that language is so rich and such nonsense. 

Political expediency, power, survival, exigency are the factors involved not mythology. But you will continue to trot out the mythology of mythology. There was a whole lot of unrest in the region before statehood of Israel. Jewish terrorist groups like Irgun did their thing. Palestinians did theirs alike-unprovoked attacks and reprisals on both sides. Jews were good with the division of land in proposed UN  partition. The Arabs were not. A coalition of Arabs led by British commander if memory serves fought the Jews and lost. 

You want law and order in conquest over land between adversaries? Is there even a square inch of land any place on earth that is "legal"? Might makes right. 

Defeating squatters does not give conquerors title to land but defeating a nation does? That is rich!

Many Jewish individuals stand out as great and noble people in a sea of silly claims and vicious attacks on those who disagree with them. To believe that some super-human power promised them land, and to act like tyrants forcing people from their ancient homeland reveals a corrupt imagined privilege that cannot stand up to scrutiny. Just because U.S., Great Britain and a group of allies "gave" land to Jews does not mean they had valid reasons for the decision. The gift of property based on ancient writings makes possible the persecution of Palestinians. Who said, who believes, who puts faith in writings of goat herders centuries ago? 

Precisely Joan.
Jews are claiming privilege they certainly don't deserve and never earned.
They never had Israel in the first place.
The nearest they came to owning their own land was during the Simon Bah Kokhba rebellion where they fought the Romans for some land and held it for about 3 years, until the Romans took the land back and killed Simon.

Funny how Simon was regarded as their True Messiah while he was winning, but as soon as he lost, sudden'y he was just another fake messiah. 

Jews are so fickle.
They are like the Chinese dynasties, the emperor is only their emperor while the crops are growing well, but a drought or pestilence ruining the crops means the emperor is suddenly a fraud, and must be murdered. 

They are a bunch of weirdos! :p 

I don't believe, for one moment, that Jews are a bunch of weirdos, I think they use propaganda and imagined communication with a nonexistent power who "promised" them a certain piece of real estate. The ancient story is not true because it is ancient, or it is true, it is a story spoken and then written down and claimed to be a reality. 

The American Indian made similar claims and the land-grabbing European settlers brushed such beliefs aside as they killed, stole, lied, ignored, discounted, trivialized, and demonized the occupants of the real estate of the Americas. 

A claim that has as its foundation ancient beliefs can maintain and perpetuate those ideas only if they have superior weapons, i.e. guns, bullets, bombs, and nuclear weapons. 

Problem with Zionism is the false claim that Zion belongs to the Jews, when in fact Jews were originally a mixture of Canaanite, Assyrian and a couple of other local tribes who fled to the hills of Judea during the invasion of the Philistines around 900 BCE.
Religion is also a major problem with the Jews believing in the false stories of their scriptures and their belief in the rebuilding of the temple of Jerusalem and the end of times, among fundamentalists.

Both Jews and Muslims claim religious tradition give them inheritance of Jerusalem, and both are wrong.

Britain should have allowed Jews to establish a state in any other of the Commonwealth colonies other than where their religion makes fake claims.

But Zionism or the reestablishing of the Jewish claim to Zion and its surrounding region, was a huge mistake.
Jews never owned the region, it was always property of Egypt, Assyria or Rome, it is doubtful any established Jewish state ever existed.

Judaism as a religion never started until after their exodus from Babylon, not Israel, in the 5th Century BCE.
At that time Zion was under Egyptian rule, not Jewish.

So religion is not irrelevant, it is playing a major part in the conflict as Jews continually try to extend their control over the region.

Before 1948 there was relative peace between Jews and Muslims, especially under the Ottoman empire where the Ottoman considered Jews as brothers of the book.

It was the British with its Zionist urging from Herzl that stirred up rivalry and instigated the Zionist plan of Al Nakba to dispossess the Palestinians which were the primary inhabitants of the land.

It is not as if the land was unoccupied as your false rhetorical gibberish makes an assumption of.

Even though it was not under any particular dynastic rule, the land was well and truly occupied by Arabs who are the descendants of the original Canaanite tribes that had existed in the region for thousands of years.

The same Canaanite tribes that Jews also descended from.

Since the original Jews were Arabs.

Your rhetoric is also propagandist driven. :-P

You have a better scope of ancient history than I; my "false rhetorical gibberish", perhaps, is propaganda driven. I do think and have always thought that land cannot be "promised" by super-human power, nor can it be "given" by a third party to one group when another group occupied it for as far back as historical time can tell. 

I don't know if DNA of Jews and Arabs are the same. I do understand that migration out of Africa can be traced through DNA.

The earliest fossils of anatomically modern humans found, so far, come from the Middle Paleolithic, about 200,000 years ago, in Ethiopia; human fossils found in Israel and S. Europe date around 90,000 years ago.

The earliest migrations and expansions of archaic and modern humans across continents began about 2 million years ago with the out of Africa migration of Homo erectus.

When new evidence appears we will make adjustments in the date of the earliest Homo sapiens. 

What is traceable is DNA. Stories, myths, and fables began as oral stories, then into written accounts. When did these narratives begin and where? 

Perhaps the Jews and Arabs learned the story of a god, or whatever you want to call it, who gave them the same story and if so, the Jews and Arabs tell the same myth and they need to learn how to live together in justice and peach.


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