this is why i am an atheist. long ago a friend died, and i had to try figure out why. i was still a mild believer. my grandma had repeatedly fed me the mantra, god is love. so why wud a just, benevolent god, who is love, create this world, filled as it is with evil? thats my question.
nother query. how many of you were turned to atheism by this?
All babies are born innocent but do they remain innocent? Is it always a fault of their surrounding if they turn out real bad?
Well, I'm not sure all babies are born innocent. At a recent Mensa gathering I heard a talk on psychopathy, and research is showing that there are inborn errors of either formation or of hormones that begin to show up in behaviors at a very early age. And a psychopath can be born into any kind of family, poor, rich, educated, uneducated, abusive, kind -- you name it. So, no, its absolutely NOT the fault of their upbringing or environment if they turn out bad.
Of course, when you are talking about other kinds of criminals, there may be more influence from environment, but the point I'm trying to make is that humans are variable in multiple ways than we can even think of, and no one, even infants, can be put in a box.
"Babies are born innocent."
Innocent? Or ignorant?
Seconds later they are self-serving savages. Others have to civilize/socialize them.
"...POWER - MONEY/WEALTH and SEXUAL FAVORS...."
If both men and women grant sexual favors, not women only, these are what each of us needs to survive and reproduce.
I take the word eveil to mean bad but to a much higher degree. I have come across people who will go to any length to satisfy their selfish interests. There are evils of other kind too. What will you call a person who rapes an underage child and the kills it? To me this is evil. A thief who murders an aged woman to loot her is an evil person. There many persons in this world who are facing very adverse circumstances. Very few of them go to the extreme end of being bad. What do you call the people who ram a plane in to a building? Does Osama deserve any other adjective?
It is an interesting point. Hitler and bin Laden are the epitomes of everything we take to be against what is good. But I wouldn't call them evil, nor their acts evil, just fantastically bad. One could, if pressed, point out some good in their actions - they fought fiercely for what they believed, they forged bonds of brotherhood with whom they shared a common ideal, etc. From this perspective, they exhibited virtues which, when taken to the extremes, and to the exclusion of all other virtues, had horrific outcomes. You can call it evil, if all you mean by it is really really really bad, but I think it is not wise for atheists to use this terminology.
It appears that I have been using the word evil in a much different sense than you all are using. I would like to know what you all mean by eveil.
i really dont know. even good and bad are reklative terms. how are the bushes diff from binladen, se=pt that bin laden is dead, killed by us? the bushes, as our president killed more of their people then bun laden ever did. yes we call one evil and the others father and son, wat? misguided? fer ex. self inflicted wounds are bad, cept when done for decorative purposes, or to save your life, or for religious reasons. killing is bad unless yer in someones recognized army, then its wonderful.
but evil exists for believers. for them its going against the will of god, unless im mistaken. thus the prob of evil is a good agument for atheism.
in time, ialways try to remember,we or our progeny, and all lifs on the=is planet will all be destroyed. is this evil? i think its just nature.
What do I call the people who flew planes into buildings?
I call them effective. They changed America.
I call 9/11 a skirmish in a much longer war over oil.
If you think 9/11 was about oil, then does it mean that it had no religious overtones? Laden always felt and the taliban also always feel that America is anti-muslim. So do the Pakistanis.
bin Laden clearly stated the reasons for 9/11 in his first videocast after that date.
Westerners on holy ground. He did not want one non-Muslim on Saudi ground nor anywhere else in the area. American's have military bases in Saudi - and that was the primary problem.
Those that talk about 'oil' are deliberately confusing the real reason. Saudi sells western nations the oil - and would regardless of whether we are occupying their lands. We should leave immediatley.
yep about oil if the saudis had none theyd have to sell camels and you cant buy many ailine tickets fer a camel.
and steve i aint deliberately doin nothin but sayin wat i think
American bases in Saudi land were not the primary reason for Laden's hate for America. All muslims see America as a strong supporter of Israel and as the Israel-Arab conflict prolongs, the dislike for America is increasing. Laden's demand for America to leave Saudi land was a consequence of this dislike for America. Had America not supported politically and militarily in the past, 9/11 might not have occured.