Measles - Atheist Nexus2019-11-21T15:02:03Zhttp://atheistnexus.org/group/nononsense/forum/topics/measles?commentId=2182797%3AComment%3A2838512&feed=yes&xn_auth=noCount me among the many peopl…tag:atheistnexus.org,2019-02-26:2182797:Comment:28396502019-02-26T19:40:10.081ZGrinning Cathttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/GrinningCat
<p>Count me among the many people who are glad you continued with real medicine, and that you're still with us!</p>
<p>Count me among the many people who are glad you continued with real medicine, and that you're still with us!</p> It wouldn't let me reply dire…tag:atheistnexus.org,2019-02-26:2182797:Comment:28395762019-02-26T19:35:36.678ZGrinning Cathttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/GrinningCat
<p>It wouldn't let me reply directly to your reply where you wrote that 4 people = 2 couples, 24 inches = 2 feet, and 60 minutes = 1 hour. That makes sense!</p>
<p>And doing arithmetic where you sometimes have to carry over into the next higher grouping (50 min. + 20 min. = 70 min. = 1 hour 10 min.) IS related to what happens with number bases. 60 seconds = 1 minute and 60 minutes = 1 hour is a similar pattern to 10 ones = 1 ten, 10 tens = 1 hundred.</p>
<p>(Talking about base 2 or 12 or 60 (or…</p>
<p>It wouldn't let me reply directly to your reply where you wrote that 4 people = 2 couples, 24 inches = 2 feet, and 60 minutes = 1 hour. That makes sense!</p>
<p>And doing arithmetic where you sometimes have to carry over into the next higher grouping (50 min. + 20 min. = 70 min. = 1 hour 10 min.) IS related to what happens with number bases. 60 seconds = 1 minute and 60 minutes = 1 hour is a similar pattern to 10 ones = 1 ten, 10 tens = 1 hundred.</p>
<p>(Talking about base 2 or 12 or 60 (or whatever) arithmetic generally means systems unlike our usual one, where you write down the numbers themselves using only 2 or 12 or 60 (or however many) different digits; that's what Tom and I were elaborating on.)</p> Cat, in the 1960s when chasi…tag:atheistnexus.org,2019-02-26:2182797:Comment:28396472019-02-26T15:38:52.306ZTom Sarbeckhttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/TomSarbeck74
<p></p>
<p>Cat, in the 1960s when chasing program bugs I read memory dumps in octal and later in hex. I don’t want to imagine, let alone read, a memory dump in binary.</p>
<p></p>
<p></p>
<p>Cat, in the 1960s when chasing program bugs I read memory dumps in octal and later in hex. I don’t want to imagine, let alone read, a memory dump in binary.</p>
<p></p> Joan, in base 13 arithmetic,…tag:atheistnexus.org,2019-02-26:2182797:Comment:28394102019-02-26T15:30:16.644ZTom Sarbeckhttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/TomSarbeck74
<p>Joan, in base 13 arithmetic, 13 donuts = 1 baker’s dozen.</p>
<p>Ho, ho, ho.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Joan, in base 13 arithmetic, 13 donuts = 1 baker’s dozen.</p>
<p>Ho, ho, ho.</p>
<p></p> Instructions for alternative…tag:atheistnexus.org,2019-02-26:2182797:Comment:28394082019-02-26T10:36:26.381ZJoan Denoohttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/JoanDenoo
<p>Instructions for alternative treatments for cancer:</p>
<p>* Cut out carbs, </p>
<p>* Apple cider vinegar, </p>
<p>* Apricot seeds from ?,</p>
<p>* I forgot the other instructions. </p>
<p>I made up my mind that I would use the dr. approved protocols. </p>
<p>Instructions for alternative treatments for cancer:</p>
<p>* Cut out carbs, </p>
<p>* Apple cider vinegar, </p>
<p>* Apricot seeds from ?,</p>
<p>* I forgot the other instructions. </p>
<p>I made up my mind that I would use the dr. approved protocols. </p> In base 2 arithmetic, 4 peopl…tag:atheistnexus.org,2019-02-26:2182797:Comment:28394072019-02-26T10:14:06.664ZJoan Denoohttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/JoanDenoo
<p>In base 2 arithmetic, 4 people = 2 couples </p>
<p>In base 12 arithmetic, 24 inches = 2 feet </p>
<p>In base 60 arithmetic, 60 minutes = 1 hour</p>
<p>In base 2 arithmetic, 4 people = 2 couples </p>
<p>In base 12 arithmetic, 24 inches = 2 feet </p>
<p>In base 60 arithmetic, 60 minutes = 1 hour</p> When I was diagnosed with can…tag:atheistnexus.org,2019-02-26:2182797:Comment:28394062019-02-26T08:46:00.667ZJoan Denoohttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/JoanDenoo
<p>When I was diagnosed with cancer, the alternative medicine folks came out of the woodwork. One fellow advised to stop chemo & radiation and start taking H2O2. I asked for valid and reliable research and he had none. I continued with my M.D.'s advice. The same with other "cures."</p>
<p>Yes! Indeed! Alternative medicine that works is called medicine. </p>
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<p>When I was diagnosed with cancer, the alternative medicine folks came out of the woodwork. One fellow advised to stop chemo & radiation and start taking H2O2. I asked for valid and reliable research and he had none. I continued with my M.D.'s advice. The same with other "cures."</p>
<p>Yes! Indeed! Alternative medicine that works is called medicine. </p>
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</div> Thanks, Tom! That should clar…tag:atheistnexus.org,2019-02-26:2182797:Comment:28396452019-02-26T08:11:47.128ZGrinning Cathttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/GrinningCat
<p>Thanks, Tom! That should clarify things in my own long answer.</p>
<p>(Quibbles/typos: "Counting from zero to ten (base <span style="text-decoration: underline;"><em>2</em></span>) looks like 0, 1, 10, ..." and "Base 12 requires two new <span style="text-decoration: underline;"><em>digits</em></span>.")</p>
<p>I've also seen base twelve written with the new digits T and E for ten and eleven: 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, T, E, 10, 11, ..., 19, 1T, 1E, 20 (which we know as twenty-four), 21,…</p>
<p>Thanks, Tom! That should clarify things in my own long answer.</p>
<p>(Quibbles/typos: "Counting from zero to ten (base <span style="text-decoration: underline;"><em>2</em></span>) looks like 0, 1, 10, ..." and "Base 12 requires two new <span style="text-decoration: underline;"><em>digits</em></span>.")</p>
<p>I've also seen base twelve written with the new digits T and E for ten and eleven: 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, T, E, 10, 11, ..., 19, 1T, 1E, 20 (which we know as twenty-four), 21, ..., 99, 9T, 9E, T0, T1, ..., TE, E0, E1, ..., EE, 100 (which we know as one hundred forty-four; yes, twelve times twelve), etc.</p>
<p>Something to add: every time we put a 0 on the end of a number, we're multiplying it by <em>whatever the number base is.</em> We're used to "1", "10", and "100" standing for one, ten, and a hundred, but those numerals stand for one, two, and four in base 2, and for one, twelve, and one hundred forty-four in base twelve.</p>
<p>(Yes, I'm spelling out some numbers, rather than assuming or explaining that "this is in base ten" and "this isn't".)</p>
<p>As I said in my own explanation, most people don't have to worry about this stuff outside math exercises!</p> After reading that article, I…tag:atheistnexus.org,2019-02-26:2182797:Comment:28396432019-02-26T07:53:35.064ZGrinning Cathttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/GrinningCat
<p>After reading that article, I switched as well.</p>
<p>You could ask your doctor what she thinks of the Mayo Clinic's website.</p>
<p>(And as always, your or my internet research can yield questions to ask and possibilities to consider; it doesn't replace doctors' experience with how common (or not) or scary (or not) those possibilities are. Not that physicians always agree! :)</p>
<p>A tangent:</p>
<p>When someone's pushing some "miracle cure being suppressed by the medical establishment",…</p>
<p>After reading that article, I switched as well.</p>
<p>You could ask your doctor what she thinks of the Mayo Clinic's website.</p>
<p>(And as always, your or my internet research can yield questions to ask and possibilities to consider; it doesn't replace doctors' experience with how common (or not) or scary (or not) those possibilities are. Not that physicians always agree! :)</p>
<p>A tangent:</p>
<p>When someone's pushing some "miracle cure being suppressed by the medical establishment", I consider that if that inexpensive, gentle, safe, effective "miracle" really were all those things, and actually worked better than the standard of care, then <em>insurance companies</em> (looking to minimize their payouts), <em>national health systems</em> (looking to make the best use of their budgets), and <em>professional associations</em> (looking to keep doctors educated and their patients happy) would most likely be <em>insisting</em> on the new treatment being studied and approved, and it would become the new standard of care.</p>
<p>A lot of our common over-the-counter medications would have seemed like miracles a few centuries ago.</p>
<p>"What do you call alternative medicine that works? Medicine."</p> Joan, it would help me to und…tag:atheistnexus.org,2019-02-26:2182797:Comment:28394042019-02-26T07:41:05.245ZGrinning Cathttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/GrinningCat
<p>Joan, it would help me to understand if I could see how you're getting those equations. (Tom's look correct to me.)</p>
<p>In case it'll help, my spiel about number bases:</p>
<p>(You know this part already:) In our usual base ten arithmetic, we use <em>ten</em> digits (0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9), and the place values (right to left) are ones, <em>tens</em>, hundreds (10 times 10), thousands, ten thousands, etc. So 12 means 1 ten and 2 ones. 304 means 3 hundreds, no tens, and 4…</p>
<p>Joan, it would help me to understand if I could see how you're getting those equations. (Tom's look correct to me.)</p>
<p>In case it'll help, my spiel about number bases:</p>
<p>(You know this part already:) In our usual base ten arithmetic, we use <em>ten</em> digits (0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9), and the place values (right to left) are ones, <em>tens</em>, hundreds (10 times 10), thousands, ten thousands, etc. So 12 means 1 ten and 2 ones. 304 means 3 hundreds, no tens, and 4 ones.</p>
<p><strong>Other number bases</strong> work the same, except they use fewer or more digits, with the place values adjusted accordingly. <strong>Most folks never need to use them, except for special cases like math exercises</strong> and computer engineering.</p>
<p>We're familiar with counting, and going from 9 to 10, 19 to 20, 99 to 100, and so on. In other number bases, it's similar <em>except</em> we run out of digits and have to use the next place value at a different point than in base ten.</p>
<p>As a rule, computers make use of binary (base 2) arithmetic behind the scenes, since it's easier to build circuits where every digit can have just two values, 0 or 1, off or on, a low voltage or a higher one.</p>
<p>In base two, with only the digits 0 and 1 to make numerals, the place values become ones, twos, fours, eights, sixteens, thirty-twos, and so on. Counting upwards from 1 gives us (no digit "2" so we have to carry over to the next place) 10, 11, 100, 101, 110, 111, 1000, etc. Twelve in binary is written as 1100 (1 eight, 1 four, 0 twos, 0 ones). (Yes, lots of digits, lots of places, lots of carries!)</p>
<p>Base three has the digits 0, 1, and 2. Counting upwards from 1 gives 2, then (out of digits, carry to the next place) 10, 11, 12, 20, 21, 22, 100, 101, 102, etc. Twelve written in base three is 110 (1 nine, 1 three, 0 ones).</p>
<p>Computer engineers and programmers sometimes use octal (base 8) or hexadecimal (base sixteen) notation, because three bits (binary digits) correspond exactly to one octal digit (eight possibilities: 000,001,...,111 in binary, 0,1,2,...,7 in octal); similarly for four bits corresponding exactly to one hexadecimal digit (0000,0001,0010,... up to 1111, corresponding to 0,1,2,...,9,A,B,C,D,E,F. Yes, A is ten, B is eleven, and F is fifteen).</p>
<p>So twelve written in base 8 is 14 (1 eight, 4 ones); twelve written in base sixteen is C (12 ones).</p>
<p>One way ordinary folks might encounter hexadecimal numerals is in the identifying numbers on some cellphones, that might come in "DEC" and "HEX" versions. Same information, different notation, like all those versions of twelve.</p>