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The portrait is Charles Darwin, age 31, in 1840

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Comment Wall


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Comment by Gary Renegar on February 6, 2011 at 5:42pm
Particularly since Mormonism is a purely designed religion, inventing from scratch a whole new bogus American history, written in bogus seventeenth century English. What's wrong with people, anyway, that they could find such a thing respectable to the point of believing it, let alone defending in it? And scarier still, there's talk of fielding a Mormon presidential candidate!
Comment by Marc Draco on February 5, 2011 at 4:33pm

Thank you Scott. No hot drinks... wonder where that came from... (I expect you can elucidate and I'm keen to know).

I actually have quite a soft-spot for the son in this family - he's walked all over by elder siblings and the father is quite mental.


Anything I could get over on the asshats over there is worth its weight in hot air.

Comment by Scott Bidstrup on February 5, 2011 at 3:35pm
Marc, your comment reminds me of a business dinner I attended a number of years ago, when I was living in Salt Lake City. It might be of some use to you.

I was working for a company owned by one of the most prominent non-Mormons in the city, but which had several very devout Mormon employees, some of whom were present. It was also attended by our corporate Washington telecoms lawyer, who had limited knowledge of Mormonism. He noted that one of those in attendance, well-known to him as a devout Mormon, was having a Coke with his meal.

"Doesn't that have caffeine in it?" he asked.

I just couldn't resist. Not waiting for a response, I pointed out that the "Word of Wisdom" - the Mormons' list of dietary restrictions - doesn't say anything about caffeine. It only prohibits "hot drinks." Coke isn't hot.

"But you Mormons drink hot herbal tea, don't you?"

"Sure," I responded, grinning with perverse pleasure. "It doesn't have any caffeine in it."

A chuckle rose from the non-Mormons.

"But what about hot chocolate? It's both hot AND has caffeine in it."

"Not forbidden. Hey, when Henri Nestle invented hot chocolate, it was 40 years after the Word of Wisdom was handed down. How was God supposed to know Henri Nestle was going to invent the stuff? Is God supposed to be omniscient or something?"

After that one, everyone broke out laughing, Mormons and non-Mormons alike. The conversation went on to other things...

Several days later, one of the really doctrinaire Mormons who had been there came by my office (which involved a special trip across town) to let me know he didn't appreciate my humor that night, and had wanted to use it as a "teachable moment." I challenged him with the logical inconsistency involved. He responded that the Word of Wisdom was revealed just to see if the members would obey it.

"Let me see if I have got this right," I said. "God restricts my freedom by handing down a totally arbitrary and capricious commandment, for no other reason than the sole purpose of seeing if I will obey it?"

He just turned around and walked out of my office. Never said anything more to me about that.

Clearly, a lot of thinking has been done, but not quite enough, it would seem, when a cranky old atheist cowboy can co-opt their "teachable moments."
Comment by Marc Draco on February 5, 2011 at 2:56pm

Scott, Park, Jean - thank you for those. I was looking to get one over on some Mormons I know (actually, we're quite friendly!). I have to laugh that although they refuse tea and coffee, they survive on a LOT of coca-cola type drinks... LMAO.


In other news, did anyone else catch David Cameron (UK PM) suggesting that Multiculturalism doesn't work? (As if the British public would be surprised at that!)


BUT - guess who came right out an bemoaned how badly done to they were (it wasn't the Chinese, Japanese or European groups).

Comment by Jean Jacques on February 4, 2011 at 6:06pm
Google 'Gene Fullmer' (A boxer from West Jordan Utah) and 'Ed Parker' (Developed Kenpo Karate, from Hawaii).

Both were active Mormons the church liked to brag about.
Comment by Scott Bidstrup on February 4, 2011 at 5:57pm
I was a Mormon for 21 years, and I never heard of any prohibition on being a boxer (though I don't think it was really encouraged). In fact, given their propensity for "self defense" things, I would be surprised if it were prohibited. Why do you ask?
Comment by Marc Draco on February 4, 2011 at 5:44pm
Wrong place to ask, I know, but to save a long discussion, does anyone here know if Mormons are allowed to become pugilists (boxers)?
Comment by Tony Davis on February 4, 2011 at 7:46am
I don't smoke, but if they swap sacrificial virgins for the smokes I'll go myself!!  I was wondering what I will do with myself now that I've retired from the Army.  Virgins, Coca leaves and Beer.....  nice.  :-)
Comment by Joseph P on February 3, 2011 at 7:33pm
  • He also showed me a tape-recording of people supposedly screaming in Hell. The story goes that some miners were digging very deep, and they got so close to Hell that they could hear people screaming.



  • Truth to be told, he does not really reflect mainstream Protestant tradition.

I think he represents the level of aggressive ignorance of a lot of them, just perhaps not the particulars.  I've met a lot of people who are so far around the curve.  It's usually paired with a similar level of general ignorance, such as the guy who couldn't remember if we were up to 44 or 45 states now.

Comment by david perry on February 2, 2011 at 11:28pm
A nice article from PZ myers about definitions of atheism.

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