Thanks for the invite, Nerd.

Here's my take on abortion. The zeitgeist about babies and human overpopulation has to change. Babies suck— literally. The world is being destroyed by humans growing like a runaway bacterium on a Petri dish, and a show like The Duggans is aired on TV, as if they're some sort of role model.

This is insane: we're losing 125 species every day, drinkable water is going scarce, millions are straving, the ice caps are melting, on and on. Humans are even killing tiny polyps in the Great Barrier Reef through blanching and acidification. No life can escape the effects of humanity of depravity.

Attitudes have to change. In a rational world no baby should be born except into a loving, capable and small family. Food, education, emotional needs, security should be readily available.

If we can prevent one girl from have an unwanted baby, it's possible to prevent every female. Why isn't it happening?

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That movie was great...and so prophetic.

I don't know if the "message" (though I doubt it really had one) is to have kids if you're smart, but do I really want my poor kid to be surrounded by morons?!
It really puts a damper on the atheist mantra that the world is becoming more intelligent doesn't it?

When in reality life is only becoming more 'advanced' for little teeny pockets of population, and eventually the have-nots will overrun us.

It's already started, and we've deserved all this chit we get :)

But I like to consider myself an optimist at least 1% of the time, and I feel that if we end imperialism and put all that money into UNIVERSAL ACCESS to education, we could reverse the trend. It's something I think atheist groups should push for, UNIVERSAL ACCESS TO EDUCATION. Let us tell Obama and Harper this. Europe's already way ahead of us on this topic.
I agree. It's just common sense.

A doctor friend of mine told me something quite disturbing today. A black gang member got chided out for NOT having babies by different women. Their goal is to increase the black population by any means possible—as it to even the score, so to speak.

Totally irresponsible, but that's the world we live in. And the state government aids and abets the practice with generous welfare programs for the unwed mothers.

"you can't tell people whether they can or can't have children" Bullshit, all right.

Makes one conjecture a benevolent dictator may be called for for the sake of the natural world.
That's the most racist thing I've ever read on this site!

Just because it's one or a couple of black thugs' attitude, doesn't mean it's prevalent.

You must not have known lots of black people in your life.
My apologies girls. It was merely something my doctor mentioned. I'm not racist, just against ab libidum reproduction no matter who it is.

The statement just came out wrong.

About the state, my point is that it's too easy to get into this bind. Social values have to change. It's a macho thing to make babies. That's the only point I wanted to make. This shouldn't be.
I'm the most vitriolic person I know of the anti-procreation persuasion. However, where I live aboriginal are encouraged to abort, before all other options, whereas the same doctors are encouraging white women to ponder the options before deciding.

the words spoken have got to be the same for each genetic line, otherwise it's camouflaged eugenics.

Just like the USA government did in Puerto Rico several decades ago. Over 50,000 Puerto Rican women were sterilised against their wishes and generally without them even knowing it.

There are always political excuses. Any family planning option must be applied exactly evenly over all races. I don't state creed here, cuz one chooses his/her creed, one does not choose their race.
TNT, I think we've roamed from the original point of the comment. I shouldn't have even mentioned race. My point was to protest a cavalier or devil-may-care attitude toward parenthood. By anybody— race has nothing to do with it.

As far as the eugenics goes, of course, the Puerto Rican incident you cited is deplorable, if true. That's what guns are for, if some bureaucrats did that to me.

Just an aside, touching on this topic, USA Today just reported that more babies in 2009 were born to minority parents than whites. Let me ask the A/N group if they see this as an ill omen. I'll be honest, I certainly do. Not because I'm racist, because there's 1.2 million people in jail in the U.S., the vast majority of which are minority.

Contrary opinions are welcome.
The brightest solution for the USA's disproportionate amount of lower class strata people in jail is as everyone stated here before : EDUCATION

In Quebec, during the 70s and 80s, we explored universal access (through near zero fees) to education, not only highschool, we're talking College and University.

That's back when we had an idealist government, boy were those nice days.

As long as the USA has a for profit education system and military invasions are considered more important than education, those jail numbers will never change.

China experimented with a one child policy. I still think that was very proactive modern thinking. My only worry is what will happen when all the single children spoiled brats get to the workplace and run society, like now! How will that change the face of China?

I'd prefer a 1 child policy AVERAGE where most women DON'T procreate, but some women procreate 3-4 or more, if they so wish. I think those are better happier kids that make healthier more caring adults. But this would be entirely unmanageable as the decision of who yes and who no, would be too politically loaded.

Globally, I'd suggest let aboriginals procreate as much as they want and stop white-Asian (West/East)-black peoples entirely. My ancestors nearly exterminated aboriginals (and in some case succeeded). Letting aboriginals outprocreate the rest of us such as myself would diversify Homo sapiens gene pool (most aboriginals aren't pure) and that's a GOOD thing for Homo Sapiens. Until all races are within some kind of balance anyway. Then we'd need a new plan.

I'd ad a contract to such a baby policy, in order for these people to procreate, they'd have to promise NOT to indoctrinate their children with any religious values :O
Beautiful. I certainly agree with most of this. My policy would be a couple be allowed to have two children. That would stop population growth. That's the killer. A two-child policy would curtail hardship a little bit and stave off sex imbalances as long as female infanticide is held in comtempt.

I wish pols, especially here in the U.S., would come to their senses on this. It looks like it'll take a murderous catastrophe for them to budge. As it is, even bringing up the subject would love him/er votes.

You said the magic word: Education.

P.S. I saw an on-line college course (Yale, I think it was) on over-population. I could forward you the link if this subject interests you.
Two children per couple: this would keep the population the same. One child per couple would cut it in half. (If a majority of the children are male, that will also lower the population--sounds terrible, but it's true.) Should sex selective abortion be illegal? At some point I realized that supporting abortion under any circumstance doesn't really match up with wanting to not allow abortion if parents wanted the opposite sex. (It would also be the same as only allowing abortions from rape; rules like that will just cause people to lie.)
I'm interested in all overpopulation readings, go ahead.

Canada's been around 1.5 for a couple of decades now, yet our population continues to grow, we keep encouraging cheap labour religious immigrants and cheap religious doctors.

Our consumer society requires more and more peons to do the dirty work in order to keep up with inflation.

A birthing policy has to have a sister immigration limit policy. OOOOhhhh but then human rights activists start chanting the open borders chant for all immigrants.

Someday we're gonna have to straighten this dilemma out. In my case, I'm totally for limiting immigration to those who can afford it (ie fee based) unless they are political refugees, which 99% of our immigrants aren't.

I don't believe in open borders to people, unless there are open border agreements to corporations, such as the EU or the way NAFTA SHOULD be.

There are a lot of reasons behind why the majority of prisons are filled with minority that has less to do with our colors or traditions, and more to do with institutional racism.



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