A building cannot assemble itself, there must be a builder. This proves god.

"Look at the perfection of design, that must suggest a designer"...or some similar argument is made by theists regularly and has become one of their church hymns. Many of them say that if a bomb goes off in a junkyard, that cannot create a fighter jet;Therefore a designer must exist for "creation.".....ummm ot really Mr. Theist.

One must be careful when debating this topic with theists as they have alot of holes they will try to suck you into.

Firstly, explain to Mr. Theist that junkyards, paintings and other man-made implements are not systems (biological or cosmical) hence they cannot assemble themselves. Evolution by natural selection however can produce a specie overtime. Explain to Mr. theist that lower life forms via natural selection, adapt to their surrounding environment hence slowly climbing "mount improbable." We have never seen bits of paper (for a painting) being assembled before our eyes but we have seen DNA being assembled many times even from non-living matter (Miller-Urey experiment as well as the more recent experiment done by the french scientist montonye see here:http://www.larouchepac.com/node/17802  shows chain links of amino acids and the basic components of life being formed through abiogenesis.) Furthermore, going by your own logic, who designed the designer? It is completely irrational to state that the designer is..."just there", as it blows a hole in your entire story.


A design does not mean there was a designer, as biological systems evolve via natural selection all on their own, this is fact.


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Comment by Antonio Chambers on June 4, 2011 at 12:07pm
yep yep. Creationists ignore evidence that evolutionists wont.
Comment by A3Kr0n on June 4, 2011 at 6:17am
My spelling sure sucks after I click add! Maybe God changed it...
Comment by A3Kr0n on June 4, 2011 at 6:15am


io - Your six dice is a good analogy, have you ever heard of a Sierpinski gasket and the chaos game? That makes very nice designs using random shakes of a dice and very simple rules. Life if very much like that, too, as with the Barnsley fern. I doubt that would have an impact of a creationist, but it sure had one on me when I first learned about them in the mid 1980's.

This is how a bomb in a junkyard can make a fighter jet. Well, you know what I mean!

Comment by Antonio Chambers on June 1, 2011 at 2:20pm
When all is said and done, this argument is very weak. Ray comfort uses it alot. He carries pictures of the mona lisa to debates and say "look, there must be a designer." Then Kirk cameron and his smug ass carried pictures of a "crocoduck" not knowing that such a specie would DISPROVE evolution. In my humble an honest opinion, they are dumb.
Comment by matt warren on June 1, 2011 at 12:29pm



one good turn for another.

Comment by Antonio Chambers on June 1, 2011 at 12:25pm
well put matt.
Comment by matt warren on June 1, 2011 at 12:14pm

mutation of gean/morphology is accidental in the way that they are "ramdomly" mutating.

you get enough of these "random" mutations and some of them will be helpfull for the oganism to thrive in a given environment.

the NON-accidental action in evolution is the survival of those oganismes with a benificial "random" mutation.

these ""surviving beneficial" mutations then go on to multiply...(divergent population/speciation) randomly mutate somemore etc...etc...etc....and on up the tree.

thats evo in a nutshell.

Comment by matt warren on June 1, 2011 at 12:00pm

any argument that starts from a premiss that meta physics is somehow real and the aberrations are to be listened to is flawed from the start and can do nothing but get more insanely incoherent as it goes along.

i.e. ray comphort.

most people just dont want to think.

Comment by Antonio Chambers on June 1, 2011 at 11:48am
hahaaha the dog/car argument "god gave man the knowledge to breed dogs small enough to fit into a car" HAHAHAHAHAH F*cking idiot. I really have sympathy for him..the fool
Comment by Antonio Chambers on June 1, 2011 at 11:44am
@Josehph ROFL Banana man is truly amazing. He and Kirk Cameron are so damn stupid. However Joseph, the banana was not developed through hybridization but "selective cultivation", but no need to get into the technicality of the matter. Ray comfort is a damn fool if i say so myself. And he walks around on the road videotaping "atheists" and asking them the origin of the universe and they can't answer. I WISH he'd come up to me. Id make him look like a damn fool. @Eric I get what you're saying  bro. You are technically still right in saying it is accidental, but it IS geared towards adaptation of the environment. So its umm...one of those things. lol

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