Charlie Check'm - What the 'Atheist' Rapper thinks About Gays


What Does ‘Atheist’ Rapper, Charlie Check’M Think About Gays?

All quotes from this thread:

“I will sell regardless of how many pro-gay Atheists don't like me.”

“I"m an Atheist and I'm against gay marriage for the same reason I'm against people marrying their pets.”

“…I don't support sibling marriage, human and pet marriage AND gay marriage.” “I wouldn't support sibling marriage and I wouldn't support gay marriage.” “I'm an Atheist and I’m against gay marriage. Why? it's because it would be unfair to a man who wants to marry his daughter or a woman who wants to marry her dog or siblings wanting to marry each other.”

“My argument isn't irrational. If gays are allowed to marry, that would be unfair to siblings who want to marry each other.”

“… gay marriage is a result of a mental disorder for the gays who became gay due to some kind of trauma and THAT'S been verified.”

“Here's my source”

“I don't hate gays. I just think they have an acceptable mental disorder.”

“If you want to include 100's of studies, you have to come to the conclusion that homosexuality is an acceptable mental disorder.
You would love for Psychologists to just stop researching now while you're ahead but the studies will go on and there are new things to discover so don't get your hopes up.”

Asked to supply evidence that gay people have 'something wrong with their brains' and what exactly is this 'something wrong'?
“You can find it here” That's a website that promotes the latest scientific studies on homosexuals.

[Narth is a right-wing fundamentalist Christian organization that has been discredited by the mainstream scientific community, shown to have repeatedly misquoted and misrepresented the work of real scientists, and has also been dismissed in an American court of law for being ideologically biased.]

Responding to: “[The people at NARTH] are religious bigots trying to hide behind what they call science.
“Now you're just making up stuff. First of all, you're out right LYING. Gay scientists have been caught masquering [sic] gay activism as science. You're accusing them of what your fellow gays are doing.”

“… the people at Narth promote scientific studies from REAL SCIENTISTS. They're not bigots like you are. You're a bigot towards ANYONE who knows something is wrong with gay people's brain.”

“Narth list several studies from several psychologists. It would be wrong to discredit every one of the studies. Pro-gay scientists have been caught masquerading gay activism as science but pro-gays won't complain about that. They would probably encourage any dishonesty that helps the gay movement.” [emphasis added]

[And as if drawing ‘evidence’ from NARTH wasn’t enough, Charlie Check’m also uses the Christian fundamentalist, discredited, Family Research Institute to support his claims!]

Pro-gay bias study of pedophilia

“The problem with research today is they need to start tricking the gay interviewees because there has been evidence of LIES told by gay people during interviews. So, they need to somehow trick the gay interviewees during the interview so the gay people can be honest. There has also has been evidence of gay psychologists masquering [sic] gay activism as science.”

“You must don't realize how easy it is for GAY scientists to rig a study. Keep in mind that the studies involve interviews with gay people. The question is, will gay people tell truth? HELL NO. They are die hard and they will lie, cheat and do what ever it takes to deceive people into thinking they aren't crazy.”

“Gay people are defined by being attracted to the wrong sex. So the very thing that makes them gay stems from a result of being molested or raped. It should be obvious that they have some kind of sexual attraction disorder. Some of them are gay because they're suffering from GID. That's been proven. The percentages are uncertain because gays lie a lot because they're trying so hard to prove they're normal.” [emphasis added]

“It's not my fault that they [gays] literally hate anyone who exposes the truth about them. They label anyone who opposes gay marriage a homophobic.”

“Pro-gay Bigots will lie and just make up ANYTHING to downplay ANYONE who knows gays are attracted to the wrong gender … PRO-GAYS WILL LIE.”

“… If you were a scientist and you discovered that homosexuality is a mental disorder, would you report it to the media or would you pretend you never discovered it? YOU WOULD DENY IT AND DESTROY ALL THE EVIDENCE BECAUSE YOU ARE BIGOTED TOWARDS ANYONE WHO DOESN'T SHARE YOUR GAY VIEWS.”

“I bet you wouldn't question a gay psychologist KNOWING he or she is probably bias. Even if you discovered a bias study by a gay pscyhologists, you probably wouldn't expose it. You would probably just keep it to yourself and continue calling ANYONE homophobic who admits that gays ar attracted to the wrong gender.”

“I"m saying that you're bias. There's a good chance that you're gay being the fact that you're so bias” [emphasis added]

“.. There have also been gay psychologists masquering [sic] gay activism as science.

Several psychologists are gay. That's something to keep in mind.”

“Atheists shouldn't have anything to do with gays.” “…Atheists primary concern should be Atheist rights, not gay rights. It seems as though gays are trying to turn the Atheist movement into a gay/Atheist movement.”

“Some of you gay people have no problem with downplaying other people's "RIGHTS" but you want to have your way. Well, gay marriage is just as bad sibling marriage …”

“I think if gay marriage became normalized, gay people believe they would have a better chance of seducing straight people. Lesbians even have a name for lesbians who prey on straight women. They're called recruiters.

“So, I believe gay marriage could be a psychological [sic] bomb to make straight people more gay-friendly and it's all for the sake of successful seduction of straight people.”

“I just think something is wrong with their brains.”

“Gay people are defined by being attracted to the wrong sex. So the very thing that makes them gay stems from a result of being molested or raped. It should be obvious that they have some kind of sexual attraction disorder"

“… people have became gay due to sexual molestation, rape ect [sic]”

“I never said EVERY gay person is gay due to sexual molestation. I SAID people have became gay due to sexual molestation.”
“ I never said ALL GAYS have been molested. I said gay people can become gay due to molestation or rape. Their have been case studies to confirm this. Some people who have been molested don't become gay because they are STRONGER. Also, if they receive some kind of therapy shortly after they've been molested, they're less likely to be gay.”

“I agree that some people are born gay which is a brain defect.”

“I don't hate you. I just think something is wrong with your brain.”

“It's just a fact of life that there are people with twisted brains who are attracted to the wrong gender. What does bother me are child molesters because they're making some people turn gay.” [emphasis added]

Quoting from NARTH: “There are occasional scientific attempts to deny or obscure the fact that a disproportionately high percentage of active homosexuals also molest children. These studies are invariably afflicted with one or more fatal flaws.” [emphasis added]

“…being lefted handed is no where near as twisted as having a part of the wrong gender's brain.”
“You said that I said, Left-Handed People Are Twisted - My reply,
That's a big lie. I never said anything about left-handed people”

“There is something twisted about being attracted to the wrong sex.”
“Just because I know some gay people are born with the wrong gender's brain doesn't mean I hate them.”

“I'm not prejudice against gays. I just know some of them became gay because they were raped. I also know that some of them have the wrong gender's brain. It's a fact. “

“When a male has a brain similar to a females, THAT'S A PROBLEM.”

“… gay Atheists don't seem to give a DAMN about everyone's rights. As a matter of a fact, I've witnessed gay Atheists not giving a damn about Atheists rights if the Atheist opposes their views about gays.”

“A gay scientists could simply lie about a study just like a Christian scientist could. Pro-gay Atheist would catch the Christian scientist hoax but probably not the gay scientist hoax because some Atheists are suffering from Christian-phobia. Keep in mind that I'm a strong Atheist and I'm totally against The belief in God and religion [sic]. I happen to think Christians and gays have a lot in common. Gay people want to hold on to the Atheist movement because they're suffering from Christian-phobia so they turn to Atheist to help them fight against Christians.”

“I think some gays are suffering [sic] from Christian-phobia or even heterophobia.”
“Sounds like you're suffering from Christian-phobia.”
“I think you're suffering from Christian-phobia”
“You're so much suffering from Christian-phobia.”
“You must be suffering from Christian-phobia. “

“Christians have told me I'm not an Atheist also.”
“I'm one of the strongest Atheist you would ever meet. How many Atheist will walk around with a t-shirt that displays "God is imaginary"

“Gays are in denial about being attracted to the wrong sex.”

“It seems like gays are trying to change the meaning of homophobic to apply pressure on people to view homosexuality as normal.”

“Deep down gays know something is wrong with them. So to counter that, they try to convince as many people as possible that nothing is wrong with them so they can feel better about themselves. Homosexuals don't want any barriers stopping them from seducing the person (gay or straight) of their choice. A major barrier is the way heterosexuals view homosexuality. In order for homosexuals to increase their chances of seducing the straight person of their choice, they need to convince as many people as possible to accept the gay lifestyle. The more heterosexuals accept the gay life style, the better chance gays will have of succeeding in seducing the straight person of their choice … Gays are hateful towards anyone who might say ANYTHING that will interfere with gays attempting to seduce the straight person of their choice.”

“Are you telling me it's not a fact that plenty gays would have a sexual relationship with a a straight person who they find EXTREMELY attractive if they are able to convince them? The gay community have people call "recruiters". These are gays who specifically prey on heterosexual people. This is a fact.”

“Playing the victim role is one of the many tactics gays use to try and downplay ANYONE who simply opposes their gay views.”

“Gays have a habit of labeling ANYONE who opposes gay marriage "homophobic"”

“Gay people think everyone has the potential of being gay.”

“…You're not mature enough to accept the fact that you're attracted to the wrong sex”

“It's irrational to assume everyone who's against gay marriage is homophobic. I'm against gay marriage but that doesn't make me homophobic. Admitting that gays are attracted to the wrong gender doesn't make a person homophobic”

“So if you think a person can be sexually attracted to the wrong species (horses), you should understand why I think a person can be sexually attracted to the wrong gender.”


“Gays including gay Atheists who label people homophobic are irrational.”

“I'm done......I won

I'm done......I won

I'm done......I won

I'm done......I won

I'm done......I won






I rest my case.

HERE'S MY GOOD BYE PRESENT...Yes the rapper is me. I'm Charlie Check'm”

Views: 978

Comments are closed for this blog post

Comment by Chrys Stevenson on August 9, 2009 at 4:27pm
I'd be honoured to have you as my toyboy Michael!
Comment by Baphomet (AIM Soldier) on August 9, 2009 at 12:35pm
Kristy you are one smart lady. I have known you about five minutes but you are already up there sister. Need a toyboy? ;) lol
Comment by Jason Spicer on August 9, 2009 at 12:31pm
And here is ripped-from-today's-headlines proof that homosexuals-are-pedophiles bigotry does real damage to innocent people, with a side of the-war-on-drugs-is-corrupting-our-criminal-justice-system.
Comment by Jason Spicer on August 9, 2009 at 12:22pm
Huh. I always wondered where baby back ribs came from.
Comment by Daniel W on August 9, 2009 at 9:07am
Looking back through the events that transpired with this, I feel a little wisened. Not wiser, just wisened.

I wasn't happy with the original post. A title asking "Do atheists hate gays" was poorly worded. Obviously, "atheists" don't "hate gays". GLBTQ people are interwoven in the fabric of this website, and atheist speakers over and over again support gay rights. Emphatically, investing personal time, effort, and passion into their support.

The strong support in the ensuing mêlée, from multiple people in multiple roles, is the best answer to the question. Again, that answer was loud and clear.

However, "atheist" just means "without god". There will be infinite variation in opinion, as well as in how well thought out the opinions are. So we've found a few atheists who, by their words express hate even when denying hate. The christian community calls this "hate the sin, love the sinner". Doing hate is hate, even if it's called something else.

I know that there are plenty of hateful people around. One of the places where they concentrate their hatefulness is antigay, although it looks like racism and ethnocentrism is on the rise recently as well. We'll see that in the atheist community too. We don't need to allow it on A|N however.

Where Charlie went over the line, IMO, was not that he continued to hold a biased, misinformed opinion about people like me. I can agree to disagree, even if I'm disagreeing with a bigot (which he is). But what he did was propagate biased hate literature unquestioningly. His method was an internet version of shouting louder, rather than reasoning. He dominated the discussion by copy/paste the same statements repeatedly, basically using the broken-record method of arguing. If he disagrees, fine.

The course of events, once he was banned, was amazing. What? He was going to represent A|N? What, he was going to head to UK, guest of ARM? Now he's not! What? He's creating a freethought rap event? But not? This guy's not just a bigot, he also not very bright, alienating the communities that would be his biggest supporters. As a career move, it's like a pediatrician sponsoring a baby barbecue.

I now have a sense of "what next". Each time I think it's over, there's a new development. What a clown he is. What a sad, pathetic clown. I hope he grows up. I want to hear his pro-GLBTQ raps.
Comment by Chrys Stevenson on August 9, 2009 at 8:52am
Quit it with the bodily fluids, will ya!
Comment by Chrys Stevenson on August 9, 2009 at 8:40am
Kristy: Sticks fingers in ears and sings "LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA!"
Comment by Chrys Stevenson on August 9, 2009 at 8:37am
Really, Black, what you and the delightful Ms C do with your bongos in the privacy of your own home is not a fitting discussion for Atheist Nexus. Really, man, have some decorum!
Comment by Chrys Stevenson on August 9, 2009 at 8:23am
Actually, I've been thinking of writing a rap song about it! I was rapping to myself while I was out in the car today. Something along the lines of:

Some 'atheist' rapper, career down the crapper
All lies and no science, unholy alliance with
Christians whose hatred should not be equated with
Atheists tryin' to stop all the lyin' ...

I know, I know ... don't give up my day job! ;-)
Comment by Chrys Stevenson on August 9, 2009 at 8:06am
One of Charlie's friends wrote this on the Atheist Examiner article.

No No No, you've got Charlie Check'm tagged all wrong. What in the he-ll is wrong with you people? You just dissed an atheist brother just because he has an odd opinion that doesn't agree with the majority? Hello!!! Isn't that the same thing atheists are fighting against? You jack-asses just did the same fu-cking thing to Charlie as those nimrod christians do all the time to atheists. What in the he-ll is going on? - Look, Charlie's main concern are the heterosexual kids that may be living with married homosexuals. He fears it would disrupt the child's natural environment and deprive the child the right to a heterosexual family. He wants to protect the rights of children. He's having trouble coming up with some justification, so the next best thing he can think of is to deny gay marriage, say they have a mental disorder, and they shouldn't be allowed to raise children, until science comes up with a better solution. He does have a valid point about the kids. I understand his concern.

I have responded to him by PM as follows:

Atheists rightly accuse Christians of drawing on quack-science to support their claims for creationism. We scorn Christians who ignore the enormous weight of scientific evidence for evolution. We know that when they claim they have ‘scientific’ evidence that disproves evolution, it either comes from ‘scientists’ who have no real qualifications in the field or who have allowed put religious bias above scientific method. We know that when Christians say that scientific ‘proof’ for creationism has appeared in scientific journals, these ‘journals’ inevitably turn out to be journals with a religious bias – not mainstream, peer-reviewed, scientific journals. In short, we know that creationists twist science to ‘prove’ their religious beliefs.

As atheists, we should be above doing the same thing.

There is no shame in being misinformed. But there is shame in refusing to become informed – especially when one’s ignorance causes great hurt to many innocent people. You claim that Charlie is just trying to protect children from homosexuals - but the truth is, children are under no more threat from homosexuals than from heterosexuals - in fact, just the opposite. I know you are angry at me - and that's fine - but please read on and give what I say some thought.

Charlie is misinformed about homosexuality. The facts about homosexuality are not based on ‘beliefs’, but upon scientific research and evidence. The mainstream medical community is united in its position, based on years of careful research, that homosexuality is not ‘chosen’ and cannot be changed; that homosexuals are every bit as well-adjusted as the heterosexual population; and that they pose no bigger (and in fact, a statistically smaller) threat to children than male heterosexuals. There may be some differences between heterosexual and homosexual brains - but this does not mean they're 'abnormal' or 'the wrong gender'. Men and women's brains are different too, but that doesn't mean that women's brains are 'abnormal' or 'wrong' or 'defective'.

This is the position of the American Psychological Association – but Charlie rejects it because it does not fit with his personal prejudices. Why Charlie thinks he knows more about psychiatry than the peak body of American psychiatrists is anyone’s guess.

Charlie (and you, it seems) are confusing homosexuality and pedophilia. Again, there is no shame in this – it is a common misconception. Just as evolution has been long accepted by the mainstream scientific community, so has the fact that homosexuality and pedophilia are two entirely separate things. In fact, it is so well accepted that it's not researched much any more - it is accepted by the mainstream scientific and medical community as proven.

The person claiming most loudly that pedophilia and homosexuality are linked is, not surprisingly, Paul Cameron, a right wing Christian. In fact, Charlie cited Cameron as a source in his discussion on Nexus. Cameron’s claims hinge on the false assumption that all male-male molestations are committed by homosexuals. To prove this, Cameron has misrepresented, misquoted and distorted mainstream scientific evidence which shows just the opposite. For example, Paul Cameron cited A Nicholas Groth to ‘back up’ his claims that pedophiles are more likely to be homosexual than heterosexual when Groth’s findings were exactly the opposite.

A. Nicholas Groth is a pioneer in the scientific study of sexual offenders against women and children. He has treated over 3000 child molesters during a career spanning more than 20 years so he is by any measure, an expert. He is also a former director of the Sex Offender Program at the Connecticut Department of Corrections. Groth explicitly states that it is a myth that men who molest boys are homosexual. And yet, Groth’s studies have been routinely misquoted and misused by Christians (including Cameron) to argue exactly the opposite. In other words, and this should be no surprise to you or to Charlie, fundamentalist Christians often lie about scientific evidence.

Groth explains that men who abuse children are either heterosexuals who may temporarily turn to boys or girls as a result of complications in their adult relations; or men who are interested only in children as sexual partners. The idea that pedophiles are attracted to boys because they are homosexual has been disproved. These men are often overtly male, are sexually repelled by adult males, and like boys because of their feminine characteristics.

In 1982, Groth wrote: “… the adult male who sexually molests young boys is not likely to be homosexual (Groth & Gary, 1982, p. 147).”

In 1998, Dr. Nathaniel McConaghy (1998), a respected Australian Professor of Psychology and Neuroscientist similarly reported that: "The man who offends against prepubertal or immediately postpubertal boys is typically not sexually interested in older men or in women" (p. 259).

The Christian right has completely abused the statistics about homosexuality and pedophilia to suit its own agenda. It serves their purpose to suggest that homosexuals are a danger to children, but the scientific data proves exactly the opposite.

By ‘buying into’ the propaganda put about by the Christian right, Charlie (and you) are allowing yourself to be deceived by those who distort science to serve their own prejudices. This has been pointed out to Charlie, but just like a Christian fundamentalist, he rejects mainstream science when it does not support his personal prejudice.

He has been offered a chance to learn why his views are not supported by evidence, but he rejected that opportunity. Just like a Christian, he did not want to learn anything which challenged his ‘beliefs’.

This is not what atheism is about. Atheism is about rejecting religious bias and embracing scientific truth – whether we like that truth or not. Just because Christians don't like the idea that Genesis is wrong, doesn't mean that evolution isn't true. It just means they are blinded by their prejudice. As atheists, we have to be willing to set aside our ‘beliefs’ and ‘prejudices’ in the face of the facts.

As someone who had set himself up as a ‘representative’ of the atheist community, Charlie brought himself down by refusing to put aside his prejudices and actually admit that science (real science – not bogus Christian science) did not support his views. He wanted to maintain his irrational belief that gays are abnormal and defective and a danger to children – when in fact, none of those claims stand up.

Sure, you will find a heap of ‘evidence’ and ‘scientific studies’ on the internet that support the view that pedophiles are homosexuals. But, if you take the time to research the authors and the journals they are in, they inevitably lead you to a person or an institution with a clearly religious bias.

Charlie’s ‘sin’ was not in being uneducated about homosexuals. It was in refusing, outright, to set aside his prejudices and learn. I hope you will not do the same.


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