I was over at Insanna’s blog
commenting on her posts, when I suddenly saw myself get swallowed into a debate with a Muslim.
I am an atheist, a secular humanist. I live a good life, like my atheist friends. I have found that secularism does not hinder the development of this.
Abdullah, a commenter on Insanna’s blog, believes that secularism is the cause of societies ills.
Two world wars, the end justfys the means philosophy? Mass starvation? Colonialism, Hitler?Stalin?Bush? Wars in Africa, Latin America? Enviromental damage? The blur between teh distinction between a man and woman?Crime? Disorder? Social meltdown? Drugs? Alchohol abuse? Single mums?
The above quote are the reasons he gave me for why a secularist society shouldn’t reign.
My response is simply this:
The problems with a religious, specifically Islamic society:
1. Intolerance to homosexuals - condoning homophobic behaviour.
2. Intolerance to apostates - condemning those who make the choice of leaving Islam. Yes you can quote the verse in the Quran that says there is no compulsion in religion, but there are also verses that completely contradict that.
3. Treatment of women - they are seen as one rank less than men. They cannot go out without a male Muslim relative accompanying them in Saudi Arabia (and that is run on ‘proper’ Shariah Law). They get blamed and stoned to death for committing adultery - even in a rape situation.
4. Young Muslim girls are married off as young as 9 years old - following the example set by the prophet Muhammad.
5. The war between Israel and Palestine? Sparked and maintained by religion.
6. The Taliban rule of Afghanistan - the fact that Afghanistan was a liberal nation before these religious fundamentalists took over. Look at how that affected their society?
7. Female genital mutilation - yes you can say that this is a completely cultural thing, but Islam is very closely tied to culture.
8. Mass starvation in African countries that are ‘Muslim’ - complete poverty.
9. Environmental damage in various religious nations occur - I remember the UAE and Pakistan to be environmentally unclean - with litter everywhere and pollution being caused by the vast amounts of carbon emission.
10. Crime and disorder? How about Iraq? Iran? Afghanistan? They aren’t exactly the most socially and politically matured countries.
11. Drugs? Many countries including Pakistan and Afghanistan have drug trades, and especially in Pakistan it’s not exactly difficult to get hold of alcohol. Same as the United Arab Emirates. I know because I’m quite well traveled.
12. Sexual abuse in Muslim nations? This ties in with the abuse of women, but there are many sex trades with young orphan boys and girls as young as 6 that go on not only in Afghanistan and Pakistan, but in Saudi Arabia. Just because you don’t hear about it on the news, it doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen. One of my friends was brought up in the suburbs close to Afghanistan and he witnessed this first hand. He got molested at a young age (he was 9 years old). So yes, I know about this personally.
Single mums? Oh yes, devil’s work right there. Those heathen nations with their single mums. Give me a break.
He also went on to say that Darwin was religious. Refer to Dawkins’ documentary, that is completely false!
Abdullah also had the nerve to tell me that Qadianis are kufrs (non-believers) - erm right, so that justifies the persecution that they have had to endure? My uncle was killed by his colleagues in a horrific murder, and then disappeared. My family was in danger of being killed purely because we were brought up in the Qadiani sect. Qadianis in Pakistan have to witness non-Qadiani Muslims abuse their ‘version’ Quran, by defacating on it.
When there are problems in a Western society, it’s corruption - due to secularism. When there are problems in an Islamic society, it’s God’s will.
If this is the ideals of an Islamic society, I want out.
Secularism all the way.
NB: Bush is not a secularist. He is a Republican Christian. He is not secular in his religious OR political ideologies - whatsoever.